AMBASSADOR'S NOVEMBER 9 MEETING WITH DEFENSE

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 04 JAKARTA 005612 E.O. 12958: DECL: 02/05/09 TAGS: PGOV PINS PHUM PINR MILI ID SUBJECT: AMBASSADOR'S NOVEMBER 9 MEETING WITH DEFENSE MINISTER JUWONO SUDARSONO ¶1. (U) CLASSIFIED BY DATT/ARMA - COL JOSEPH H. DAVES, USA, REASON, 1.5 (B) AND (D). ¶2. (C) SUMMARY: DURING A FRIENDLY 75 MINUTE DISCUSSION, NEWLY APPOINTED MINISTER FOR DEFENSE AND SECURITY DR. JUWONO SUDARSONO SIGNALED THAT HE IS SERIOUS ABOUT IMPLEMENTING FUNDAMENTAL, LONG TERM MILITARY REFORMS. WHILE CLEARLY RECOGNIZING THE TOUGH CHALLENGES AHEAD FOR THE MILITARY, MINISTER SUDARSONO SAID ALL THE RIGHT THINGS IN DESCRIBING HIS VISION FOR A MORE PROFESSIONAL VALUES-BASED ARMED FORCES. SUDARSONO EXPRESSED CONCERN OVER THE INTERNATIONAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY (COI) THAT WILL INVESTIGATE HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS IN EAST TIMOR. NOT ONCE DID HE MENTION HIS PREDECESSOR, GENERAL WIRANTO. ¶3. (C) THE AMBASSADOR CONVEYED THE U.S. DESIRE TO SUPPORT THE TERRITORIAL INTEGRITY OF INDONESIA, TO HELP BUILD STRONG DEMOCRATIC INSTITUTIONS AND TO HELP INDONESIA DEVELOP AN OPEN, MARKET-ORIENTED ECONOMY. HE EMPHASIZED THE IMPORTANCE OF SOLVING THE WEST TIMOR REFUGEE PROBLEM ONCE AND FOR ALL SO THE NEW GOVERNMENT IN JAKARTA WILL RECEIVE THE INTERNATIONAL SUPPORT IT DESERVES. HE ASKED FOR MINISTER SUDARSONO'S ASSISTANCE IN ESTABLISHING FORMAL LIAISON BETWEEN INTERFET AND TNI TO ADDRESS BORDER ISSUES AND ASSIST WITH OVERLAND RETURN OF REFUGEES. END SUMMARY. CONFIDENTIAL PAGE 03 JAKART 05612 01 OF 04 101034Z ¶4. (C) ON NOVEMBER 9, THE AMBASSADOR PAID AN INTRODUCTORY CALL ON THE NEWLY APPOINTED MINISTER OF DEFENSE AND SECURITY, DR. JUWONO SUDARSONO. ALSO IN ATTENDANCE WERE FOREIGN POLICY ADVISOR MG ALBERT PARUNTU, CHIEF OF FOREIGN RELATIONS FIRST ADMIRAL ZULKIFI LUBIS AND MILITARY SECRETARY COLONEL BAMBANG HERU SUKMADI. DATT/ARMA ACCOMPANIED THE AMBASSADOR AS NOTETAKER. GUS DUR MEETING WITH THE PRESIDENT -------------- ¶5. (C) THE AMBASSADOR CONGRATULATED SUDARSONO AS INDONESIA'S FIRST CIVILIAN MINISTER OF DEFENSE AND SECURITY IN OVER 40 YEARS AND ANNOUNCED WITH PLEASURE THAT PRESIDENT CLINTON WOULD MEET WITH PRESIDENT WAHID ON FRIDAY IN WASHINGTON DC, DESPITE AN EXTREMELY TIGHT SCHEDULE AND ONGOING BUDGET NEGOTIATIONS BETWEEN THE WHITE HOUSE AND CONGRESS. PRESIDENT CLINTON HAS MADE TIME TO SEE PRESIDENT WAHID BECAUSE THE U.S. VIEWS GOOD RELATIONS WITH THE NEW INDONESIAN GOVERNMENT TO BE CRITICALLY IMPORTANT, HE SAID. STRONG COMMITMENT TO MILITARY REFORMS -------------- ¶6. (C) MINISTER SUDARSONO SAID HE IS FULLY COMMITTED TO MILITARY REFORMS. AS THE FIRST CIVILIAN DEFENSE MINISTER SINCE 1947, HE CLEARLY UNDERSTOOD THAT HE "SYMBOLIZES A NEW BEGINNING," MAKING IT THAT MUCH MORE IMPORTANT THAT HE "TAKE THE RIGHT STEPS." HE OUTLINED THE MANY CHALLENGES FACING THE NEW GOVERNMENT IN DEVELOPING THE CONFIDENTIAL PAGE 04 JAKART 05612 01 OF 04 101034Z VIABLE INSTITUTIONS IN THE INDONESIAN SOCIETY THAT WILL SUPPORT AND SUSTAIN GRADUAL DEMOCRATIZATION AND ENABLE THE INDONESIAN ARMED FORCES TO MOVE AWAY FROM THE POLITICAL ROLE TNI HAD PLAYED FOR THE PAST 15 YEARS TO BECOME A MORE PROFESSIONAL FORCE. HE SAID THE CURRENT PROBLEMS OF THE MILITARY ARE NOT TOTALLY TNI'S FAULT SINCE THE ARMED FORCES WERE MISUSED BY THE CIVILIAN GOVERNMENT IN THE PAST. THE ARMY IS NOW ACCEPTING ITS NEW ROLE IN A MORE DEMOCRATIC SOCIETY, HE SAID. ¶7. (C) MINISTER SUDARSONO EMPHASIZED THE SEVERE IMPACT OF THE ECONOMIC CRISIS THAT CAUSED GDP PER CAPITIA IN INDONESIA TO PLUMMET FROM USD 1300 IN EARLY 1997 TO ABOUT USD 600 PRESENTLY. THE LOWER MIDDLE CLASS AND POOR HAVE BEEN ESPECIALLY HARD HIT, HE SAID. THAT IS WHY THERE HAS BEEN SO MUCH SOCIAL UNREST AND VIOLENCE IN THE COUNTRY; SO MANY PEOPLE HAVE LOST THEIR LIVELIHOOD AND HOPE. THE RESULTANT SECURITY PROBLEMS HAVE MADE TNI'S ROLE MORE DIFFICULT AND COMPLICATED INTERNAL MILITARY REFORMS. SUDARSONO SAID THE ARMED FORCES FIRST NEED TO DEVELOP THE RIGHT DOCTRINE, THEN PROCEED WITH MEASURED STEPS TO REFORM THE MILITARY INSTITUTION. ¶8. (C) SUDARSONO EXPRESSED CONCERNS ABOUT "THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES OF GLOBAL MARKET ECONOMICS," THAT CAN HAVE A DEVASTATING EFFECT ON CERTAIN PARTS OF SOCIETY IN DEVELOPING ECONOMIES LIKE INDONESIA. THIS IS ESPECIALLY TRUE FOR THOSE WITHOUT THE REQUISITE SKILLS TO PARTICIPATE IN THE GLOBAL MARKETPLACE, HE SAID. OUR GOAL IS TO HELP INDONESIA SUCCEED -------------- ¶9. (C) THE AMBASSADOR TOLD SUDARSONO THAT PEOPLE HAVE HIGH EXPECTATIONS FOR THE WAHID GOVERNMENT. THE ELECTIONS WERE A "TRIUMPH FOR DEMOCRACY" AND HE HAD PERSONALLY BEEN IMPRESSED BY THE NEW PRESIDENT'S VISION FOR THE COUNTRY. THE AMBASSADOR CONVEYED THE U.S. DESIRE TO SUPPORT THE TERRITORIAL INTEGRITY OF INDONESIA, TO HELP BUILD STRONG DEMOCRATIC INSTITUTIONS AND TO HELP INDONESIA DEVELOP AN OPEN, MARKET-ORIENTED ECONOMY. THE NATIONAL SECURITY INTEREST OF THE U.S. IS A STRONG, UNITED INDONESIA TO SERVE AS AN ANCHOR OF STABILITY FOR THE SOUTHEAST ASIAN REGION. INSTABILITY IN INDONESIA WOULD CAUSE PROBLEMS THROUGHOUT ASIA, HE SAID. IN ACCORDANCE WITH INDONESIA'S WANTS AND DESIRES, THE AMBASSADOR SAID THE U.S., AS THE OLDEST DEMOCRACY IN THE WORLD, IS PREPARED TO OFFER EXPERT ASSISTANCE WITH ISSUES OF DEMOCRATIC TRANSITION AND CONFLICT RESOLUTION, RESTRUCTURING OF THE JUSTICE SECTOR AND ECONOMIC REFORMS, IN ADDITION TO CIVIL- MILITARY RELATIONS AND MILITARY REFORMS. OUR GOAL IS TO HELP INDONESIA SUCCEED, HE SAID. DESIRE FOR IMPROVED BILATERAL MILITARY RELATIONS -------------- -- ¶10. (C) THE AMBASSADOR EXPRESSED HIS STRONG DESIRE TO GET BACK TO A NORMAL MILITARY RELATIONSHIP WITH INDONESIA. HE SAID THE U.S. LOOKS FORWARD TO HAVING SUDARSONO VISIT WASHINGTON AT THE APPROPRIATE TIME TO MEET WITH SECRETARY COHEN AND PERHAPS SOME MEMBERS OF CONGRESS; CINCPAC ADMIRAL BLAIR ALSO LOOKS FORWARD TO MEETING HIM AND ADMIRAL WIDODO, HE SAID. MINISTER SUDARSONO SAID THAT BILATERAL MILITARY RELATIONS CURRENTLY IS THE MOST CRUCIAL AREA OF INDONESIA-U.S. RELATIONS. THE AMBASSADOR EMPHASIZED THE IMPORTANCE OF EXPEDITING WEST TIMOR REFUGEE RETURNS AS AN ACTION THAT WOULD HELP OPEN THE DOOR TO CLOSER DEFENSE COOPERATION. GOALS AND VISION FOR MILITARY REFORMS -------------- ¶11. (C) IN RESPONSE TO THE AMBASSADOR'S QUERY ON GOALS AND VISION FOR MILITARY REFORMS, MINISTER SUDARSONO SAID THE MOST IMPORTANT ASPECT IS TO REVISE THE LONG-TERM DEFENSE MANAGEMENT SYSTEM. AGAIN, SUDARSONO SAID IT IS IMPORTANT TO QUICKLY RESTORE BILATERAL MILITARY RELATIONS, ESPECIALLY IMET (THE U.S. INTERNATIONAL MILITARY EDUCATION AND TRAINING PROGRAM). SUDARSONO SAID HE WOULD LIKE TO SEND A CORE GROUP OF 15 TO 20 OF TNI'S BEST AND BRIGHTEST OFFICERS FROM ALL THREE SERVICES (INCLUDING JUNIOR, MID-GRADE AND SENIOR OFFICERS FROM EACH SERVICE) TO THE U.S. FOR IMET TRAINING. THIS "HORIZONTALLY INTEGRATED" GROUP OF OFFICERS WOULD BE KEPT TOGETHER FOR THE NEXT 10 TO 15 YEARS AND EMPLOYED IN LONG TERM PLANNING AND IMPLEMENTATION OF MILITARY REFORMS, HE SAID. ¶12. (C) CONTINUING, SUDARSONO SAID THAT INDONESIA MUST DEVELOP COLLABORATIVE AND AFFORDABLE MUTUAL SECURITY ARRANGEMENTS WITH ITS NEIGHBORS (SPECIFICALLY MENTIONING SINGAPORE AND AUSTRALIA). "OUR BIG PROBLEM IS MONEY," HE SAID. IT WILL BE HARD TO CONVINCE THE NEW LEGISLATURE TO GIVE THE DEFENSE MINISTRY MORE MONEY UNDER CURRENT CONSTRAINED ECONOMIC CONDITIONS. WEST TIMOR REFUGEE RETURNS A TOP PRIORITY -------------- ¶13. (C) THE AMBASSADOR PROVIDED IMPRESSIONS FROM HIS RECENT VISIT TO WEST AND EAST TIMOR. HE HAD BEEN IMPRESSED, HE SAID, BY THE SINCERITY OF WEST TIMOR GOVERNOR PIET TALLO AND OTHER GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS IN THEIR DESIRE TO RESOLVE THE REFUGEE PROBLEM IN WEST TIMOR. OFFICIALS IN WEST TIMOR ARE POSITIVELY MOTIVATED AND THE U.S. GOVERNMENT IS PREPARED TO PROVIDE APPROPRIATE ECONOMIC ASSISTANCE IN WEST TIMOR, AS WELL AS EAST TIMOR, HE SAID. HOWEVER THE REFUGEES MUST BE GIVEN A FREE CHOICE. THERE ARE STILL PROBLEMS WITH MILITIA MEMBERS IN THE REFUGEE CAMPS PREVENTING THE FREE MOVEMENT OF THOSE WHO WISH TO RETURN. THE MILITIAS ARE UNDERMINING THE GOVERNOR'S AUTHORITY, THE AMBASSADOR SAID. THIS IS A PROBLEM BECAUSE EAST TIMOR IS STILL GETTING IN THE WAY OF THE STRATEGIC ISSUE - THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY'S ABILITY TO SUPPORT INDONESIA IN THIS NEW MORE DEMOCRATIC PHASE OF THE NATION'S HISTORY. IT IS ESSENTIAL THAT THE REFUGEE ISSUE BE SOLVED ONCE AND FOR ALL TO GAIN THE NEW GOVERNMENT IN JAKARTA THE INTERNATIONAL SUPPORT IT DESERVES. MINISTER JUWONO RESPONDED POSITIVELY TO THIS MESSAGE AND PROMISED TO WORK TOWARD THIS GOAL. NEED FOR LIAISON BETWEEN TNI AND INTERFET -------------- ¶14. (C) THE AMBASSADOR ASKED FOR MINISTER SUDARSONO'S ASSISTANCE IN ESTABLISHING FORMAL LIAISON BETWEEN INTERFET AND TNI TO ADDRESS BORDER ISSUES AND ASSIST WITH OVERLAND RETURN OF REFUGEES. INTERFET COMMANDER MG COSGROVE HAS ACTIVEY SOUGHT, BUT SO FAR HAS BEEN UNABLE TO SET UP ANY FORMAL COORDINATION PROCESS ON BORDER ISSUES WITH TNI. SUCH A LIAISON ARRANGEMENT IS CRITICALLY IMPORTANT TO LOWER TENSIONS, PROMOTE MUTUAL UNDERSTANDING, TO FACILITATE MOVEMENTOF REFUGEES BACK ACROSS THE BORDER INTO EAST QIMOR, AND AVOID ANY FURTHER UNFORTUNATE BORDEQ INCIDENTS BETWEEN INTERFET AND INDONESIAN SECRITY FORCES. THE U.S. STRONGLY SUPPORTS SUCHCOOPERATION. EXISTING "AD HOC" COMMUNICATIONS ARE SIMPLY NOT ADEQUATE TO FACILITATE THE FLOW OF PEOPLE AND COMMERCE ACROSS THE BORDER. WITH HEAVY RAINS ALREADY STARTED, A BROAD CONFIDENCE BUILDING MECHANISM IS URGENTLY NEEDED TO FACILITATE REFUGEE RETURNS, HE SAID. ¶15. (C) IN RESPONSE TO MINISTER SUDARSONO'S SUGGESTION THAT THE ISSUE BE TAKEN UP WITH THE FOREIGN MINISTRY, THE AMBASSADOR EMPHATICALLY REMONSTRATED THAT THE PROBLEM IS ON THE GROUND. IT IS TOTALLY NECESSARY TO HAVE PROVISIONS FOR DIRECT COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN SECURITY FORCES TO LOWER TENSIONS AND AVOID FURTHER ACCIDENTS. SUDARSONO AGREED THAT A PARALLEL DIPLOMATIC AND PRAGMATIC APPROACH IS NEEDED TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM AND PROMISED TO HELP. MILITIA STATUS -------------- ¶16. (C) THE AMBASSADOR EXPRESSED HOPE THAT IN THE FUTURE, EAST TIMOR WILL BE ABLE TO MAINTAIN A CLOSE AND POSITIVE RELATIONSHIP WITH ITS BIG NEIGHBOR, INDONESIA, AND SAID IT IS FORTUNATE THAT XANANA GUSMAO IS A MODERATE AND REASONABLE PERSON. MINISTER SUDARSONO AGREED THAT IT WAS A GOOD THING THAT XANANA WAS TREATED WELL DURING HIS DETENTION IN JAKARTA. "XANANA STILL HAS MANY FRIENDS HERE," HE SAID. SUDARSONO SAID IT WOULD BE HELPFUL IF XANANA WOULD SEND MORE SIGNALS OF RECONCILIATION TO THOSE PRO-INTEGRATION SUPPORTERS REMAINING IN WEST TIMOR. THE GOVERNMENT IS TRYING TO ENCOURAGE THOSE MILITIA MEMBERS WHO DO NOT WANT TO RETURN TO EAST TIMOR TO LEAVE WEST TIMOR AND SETTLE ELSEWHERE IN THE COUNTRY WITH GOVERNMENT HELP. HOWEVER, MANY WOULD LIKE TO RETURN IF THEIR SAFETY COULD BE GUARANTEED. THEY WOULD PREFER TO WAIT IN WEST TIMOR AND MANY HAVE REFUSED TO LEAVE THE ISLAND, HE SAID. CONCERN OVER AN INTERNATIONAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY -------------- -------------- ¶17. (C) MINISTER SUDARSONO SAID THAT THE SYMBOLISM OF THE HUMANITARIAN EFFORTS IN WEST AND EAST TIMOR MATCHES GUS DUR'S RECONCILIATORY PHILOSOPHY AND VISION. AT THE SAME TIME, SUDARSONO EXPRESSED CONCERN OVER THE INTERNATIONAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY (COI) THAT WILL INVESTIGATE HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS IN EAST TIMOR. THE AMBASSADOR SAID THAT IT IS FORTUNATE MARZUKI DARUSMAN, THE NEW INDONESIAN ATTORNEY GENERAL AND HEAD OF THE NATIONAL HUMAN RIGHTS COMMISSION (KOMNAS HAM),HAS EXCELLENT CREDIBILITY WITH THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY. A CREDIBLE KOMNAS HAM INVESTIGATION WITH THE FULL COOPERATION OF THE INDONESIAN MILITARY WOULD DIMINISH THE PRESSURE FOR INTERNATIONAL INVOLVEMENT, HE SAID. HOWEVER, THE AMBASSADOR ADDED, THE HEAD OF THE COI, SONIA PICADO, A PERSONAL FRIEND AND A TRUE PROFESSIONAL, WOULD TAKE A REASONABLE, LOW KEY APPROACH TO THE INVESTIGATION WITHOUT RESORTING TO A MEDIA CIRCUS. KOMNAS HAM SHOULD WORK QUIETLY WITH THE INTERNATIONAL COI AND AVOID PUBLIC CONFRONTATION, HE SAID. ¶18. (C) THE AMBASSADOR MENTIONED SEVERAL ISSUES IN CLOSING. HE SAID AMBASSADOR HOLBROOKE PLANS TO VISIT JAKARTA ON 19 OR 20 NOVEMBER AND WOULD VERY MUCH LIKE TO MEET SUDARSONO AND OTHER KEY MINISTERS. THE AMBASSADOR MENTIONED RECENT DIFFICULTIES IN OBTAINING TNI FLIGHT CLEARANCE TO OPERATE THE USDAO C-12 AIRCRAFT IN COUNTRY, ASKING FOR THE MINISTER'S ASSISTANCE TO RESOLVE THIS PROBLEM AND EMPHASIZING THE NEED FOR EMBASSY MEMBERS TO TRAVEL FREELY IN THE COUNTRY. THE AMBASSADOR EXPRESSED THE STRONG DESIRE FOR CONTINUED CLOSE COOPERATION ON COUNTER-TERRORISM MATTERS AND OFFERED TO SEND AN EMBASSY REPRESENTATIVE TO PROVIDE MINISTER SUDARSONO WITH A DETAILED BRIEFING ON THIS SUBJECT. FINALLY, THE AMBASSADOR BRIEFLY DISCUSSED THE U.S. LEGISLATION ON MILITARY TRANSPARENCY AND PROVIDED MINISTER SUDARSONO WITH A MORE DETAILED NON-PAPER ON THE ISSUE. MINISTER SUDARSONO WAS ALREADY GENERALLY KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT THE LEGISLATION. MYERS