VFM VALERO ON BILATERAL DIALOGUE

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 03 CARACAS 000146 SIPDIS SIPDIS DEPT FOR WHA AND A/S SHANNON DEPT PASS TO AID/OTI PRORTER HQSOUTHCOM ALSO FOR POLAD E.O. 12958: DECL: 01/22/2032 TAGS: PGOV PREL US VE SUBJECT: VFM VALERO ON BILATERAL DIALOGUE REF: 06 CARACAS 03636 CARACAS 00000146 001.2 OF 003 Classified By: Ambassador William R. Brownfield for reason 1.4(b) Summary -------------- ¶1. (C) The Ambassador met with VFM Valero on Jan 19 to discuss possible topics for bilateral dialogue, following up on his earlier discussion with FM Maduro. We also took the opportunity to clear out some pending bilateral issues; of those the most interesting BRV response came on reciprocity, when Valero indicated the BRV wants to talk about VAT reimbursement. Following the schema suggested in his meeting with Maduro, the Ambassador probed bilateral discussions on energy, trade, drugs, terrorism/security, and extradition/judicial cooperation. In each case, Valero had little to offer, nodding sagely and saying he'd have to consult. Because many of these issues do cut into other ministries, that's not an unreasonable position. That said, our guess is that his brief was to listen and report back. Their court is rather littered with balls; let's see if they throw any back. End summary. Pending Items -- Carnets, Consulate, Clearances -------------- -- ¶2. (C) Ambassador and DCM met with BRV VFM Jorge Valero and DG for North America Yaneth Arocha on Jan 19 to discuss possible topics for bilateral dialogue. Before launching into that matter, the Ambassador cleared away a few pending matters, including: -- MFA payment for Embassy cleanup. The Ambassador acknowledged the MFA reimbursement for the costs of cleaning up a the damages caused to Embassy properties during a BRV-provoked demonstration in February 2006. -- Carnet and visa renewals. Noting that while the MFA was now (finally) current on carnets and visa renewals for Embassy personnel, the Ambassador stated that we would enter into another busy period as our summer rotations started in June. The Ambassador said he hoped this issue was in the past, and Valero agreed. In this context, Valero indicated that BRV tax agency SENIAT was moving closer to a point-of-sale VAT deduction process (card) for accredited diplomats, and that he would soon be organizing a meeting for the U.S. and Canadian Embassies with SENIAT Superintendent Vielma Mora to discuss the matter. -- Maracaibo consulate. The Ambassador said he would be visiting Maracaibo at the end of the month, where the press would query him about the reopening of the U.S. consulate there. He would respond that the matter was with the BRV. Valero nodded sagely. (Note: MFA DG for Consular Affairs Coromoto Godoy told the DCM on Jan 16 that the decision package on the Maracaibo consulate was with President Chavez. End note.) -- Possible hospital ship visit. The Ambassador indicated that the USNS Comfort hospital ship would be in the region in August, and that the Embassy would soon be sending an invitation to the BRV to visit or participate, including one or more port calls in Venezuela. Valero said he looked forward to receiving our note. -- Scientific ship clearances. Several times over the last 18 months, the Embassy has requested permission for U.S. scientific ships to enter Venezuelan waters, but has failed to receive any response. These vessels perform only scientific activities, and are entirely transparent. They are normally associated with U.S. universities, welcome Venezuelan shipriders, and share their findings with the scientific community. We would be willing to brief the BRV on the nature of these ships and their visits. Valero suggested a briefing might be useful. -- Entry into the Maiquetia FIR. The Ambassador foreshadowed a diplomatic note we would soon be passing to the BRV laying out our legal position with respect to flights by U.S. state aircraft through the Maiquetia Flight Information Region (FIR). The note was important, because we did not want a situation in the future where two armed military aircraft confronted each other over the Caribbean due to legal misunderstanding. Our view was that FIR was a flight safety issue, not a sovereignty issue. Once they saw our legal CARACAS 00000146 002.2 OF 003 position, they could give us their interpretation. Valero nodded. Next Steps on Dialogue -------------- ¶3. (C) The Ambassador opened by noting that in his discussion with FM Maduro (reftel),consensus had been reached on five possible issues for dialogue: energy, trade, drugs, terrorism/security, and extradition/judicial cooperation. The next step, as Maduro agreed, is for the Ambassador and Valero to prepare the terrain for actually executing such a dialogue. ¶4. (C) Energy. Over the last two weeks, the BRV embassy in Washington has made some suggestions to the Department as to how to proceed in this area, with the apparent goal of setting up a meeting between Energy Minister Ramirez and Energy Secretary Bodman. The Ambassador indicated that the logical first step was a working level, technical meeting at the Department. That group could discuss an agenda, at which point we could jointly determine how to proceed. Valero -- who apparently was learning for the first time of the BRV embassy outreach, took a bit of a shot at BRV Ambassador Alvarez ("he's very active"),then tried to leave the issue, saying they'd consider our suggestion and get back to us. The Ambassador pushed back, noting that we were in fact responding to their ideas, lodged in Washington. The Ambassador noted we were agnostic as to whether the meeting would occur in Washington or Caracas. Valero gave a deliberative look, noted he'd have to consult with FM Valero and Minister Ramirez, and said he would get back to us. ¶5. (C) Trade. The Ambassador said that the recent BRV statements on nationalizing firms with significant U.S. investment (CANTV and EDC) made it difficult to proceed positively in this area at the moment. Any dialogue would have to include discussion of those matters. Valero understood, and indicated that he had spoken with the Venezuelan-American Chamber of Commerce (Venamcham),which wanted a dialogue with the BRV. Valero suggested that perhaps the U.S.-BRV discussions on trade and commerce begin within a Venamcham context, perhaps leading to a U.S.-Venezuela Business Roundtable in the United States. The Ambassador liked using Venamcham as a catalyst for such discussions, but suggested that the private sector would have to make the decision about a business roundtable. Valero nodded wisely. ¶6. (C) Drugs. The Ambassador opened the discussion by indicating that the BRV had gotten itself into a box on this issue, and offered four ideas to help them get out of it, each one with an decreasing level of commitment on the part of the BRV. The Ambassador's suggestions to the BRV: -- sign the CN cooperation addendum -- sign the LOA with NAS, without making reference to DEA -- explore the willingness of DEA leadership to come to Venezuela to discuss the BRV's political concerns -- explore using UN, OAS, third countries, or NGOs to facilitate indirect cooperation. Valero was cautious on this issue, underlining that he needed to consult with Interior Minister Carreno. That said, he showed some interest in a DEA visit. With respect to the final option, the DCM noted that UNDCP told us it was recently informed that the BRV would not cooperate with them on any program with USG involvement. Valero deliberated briefly, and then did not respond. ¶7. (C) Terrorism/security. The Ambassador opened this matter by underlining that this was an area of shared concerns, where we ought to be able to find a way to collaborate. He said as a first step, we want a system where we can verify whether specifically named individuals have traveled through Venezuela during specified times. It was most appropriate to handle this through police channels, the Ambassador said, and so proposed that the Legatt meet with designated BRV representatives to open dialogue on these issues and identify other terrorism/security issues worth discussion. Valero seemed attracted by the idea, and said he would talk to the new Interior Minister (again) and get back to us. ¶8. (C) Extradition/judicial cooperation. This is an issue first broached by FM Maduro. The Ambassador indicated that CARACAS 00000146 003.2 OF 003 discussions focused on past cases like Posada, the two GN officers, and the three drug traffickers whose extradition they had denied were likely to be sterile. Those were closed matters, unlikely to be reopened. By contrast, if we focused on active cases and solving the problems which had arisen in these earlier extradition cases, we could potentially make some progress. Our suggestion, then, was to get together U.S. and BRV prosecutors and Department and MFA legal advisers at the technical level to hammer out issues to be discussed. Valero said he thought that sounded like a good idea, but that he needed to consult with the Ministry of Interior and Justice, and would get back to us. ¶9. (C) Civil aviation. The Ambassador noted in closing that we had made good progress over the past year in civil aviation issues. It makes sense to have a systematic technical dialogue on these issues, particularly because there was evidence that flights between our two countries would increase in the near term. Again, Valero agreed, and said he would consult and get back. Comment -------------- ¶10. (C) Valero clearly was not ready to discuss specifics or make commitments; our guess is that his brief was to listen and report back. Their court is rather littered with balls; let's see if they throw any back. BROWNFIELD