DELEGATION PROPOSES HSPD-6 INFO SHARING WITH

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 02 BERLIN 003435

SIPDIS

SIPDIS

ALSO FOR NCTC, TSC
USEU FOR MRICHARD

E.O. 12958: DECL: 12/06/2016
TAGS: PTER KHLS CVIS GM
SUBJECT: DELEGATION PROPOSES HSPD-6 INFO SHARING WITH
GERMANY

REF: A. BERLIN 2058


B. BERLIN 2785

Classified By: Minister-Counselor for Economic Affairs Robert F. Cekuta
for Reasons 1.4 (b) and (d)


1. (C) Summary. An interagency U.S. delegation presented
German officials with a proposal to share terrorist screening
data as called for in HSPD-6. The meeting between the U.S.
delegation and the German side, headed by the Interior
Ministry, November 8 in Berlin followed previous bilateral
discussions (ref A) and Interior Minister Schaeuble's
September visit to Washington (ref B). During that visit,
the German minister proposed a U.S.-German Working Group on
sharing counterterrorism data. German officials see the
HSPD-6 proposals as among the options they could consider in
the context of the Working Group. (Note: the Working Group
is to hold its first meeting December 12 in Berlin. End
Note.) The German officials were in "listening mode" as they
had promised, but indicated willngness to positively
consider HSPD-6, presumablywith a hit / no hit inquiry
system, as part of a U.S.-German "Pruem"-style agreement.
End Summary.

--------------
INTERIOR MINISTRY
--------------


2. (SBU) The Federal Ministry of the Interior hosted the
delegation's principal meeting November 8 in Berlin, which
representatives of the Justice and Foreign Ministries as well
as the Federal Office for Criminal Investigation (BKA) also
attended. A representative from the independent Office of
the Federal Commissioner for Data Privacy and Freedom of
Information was present as well, potentially signaling the
importance of those issues for the German side. Terrorist
Screening Center Acting Director Rick Kopel gave a
presentation that described the benefits to Germany of
terrorist information data sharing and also stressed U.S.
sensitivity to tailoring an information sharing program to
meet German legal and regulatory concerns. State S/CT
Advisor Fred Vogel gave a presentation on the PISCES border
screening program in place in Iraq, Afghanistan, and
Pakistan, not as an example of what the U.S. envisions for
Germany, but to illustrate the value and breadth of data U.S.
terrorist databases receive. The U.S. presenters also
discussed the introduction of biometric, not just biographic,
data into the Terrorist Screening Database (TSDB).


3. (C) Questions from the nearly twenty German officials
present were diverse: Would the U.S. use any data Germany
provided for renditions? Why had so many travelers
complained about U.S. port of entry systems? With what other
countries did the U.S. have HSPD-6 agreements? Head of the
German delegation Interior Ministry Office Director for
Police Information Systems, the BKA Law, and Data Privacy in
Security Affairs Andreas Schultz explained Minister Schaeuble
had tasked him to establish the U.S.-German Working Group.
Germany would need a new law to enable some of the programs
the U.S. envisions; EU mechanisms enable German authorities
to share with EU partners but do not envision sharing the
data with non-EU countries, according to Schultz. Germany
cannot "just give you everything we have," Schultz said, but
Germany is prepared to discuss a program to enable initiating
inquiries and providing information pursuant to a request,
e.g., in a hit / no hit system. Germany could also share
data in the event of a threat or if a crime was going to be
committed. He explained that EU Data Privacy regulations
prevent the broad sharing of lists even within the EU, which
is why Germany created the Pruem agreements. Pruem is a new
road, envisioning a hit / no hit system for DNA and
fingerprint data. If there is a hit, only then, with both
sides processing information about a subject and having
identified a reason to share the data, would the two sides
exchange information via existing channels. Germany is aware
of the threat it faces, Schultz continued, and does not want
only to dwell on impediments and the possible difficulties
facing a U.S.-German agreement. The two sides are embarking
on a "promising path," but Germany will need a legal basis
for whatever the two sides agree.

--------------
FOREIGN MINISTRY
--------------


BERLIN 00003435 002 OF 002



4. (C) Office Director for Counterterrorism Cooperation
Matthias Sonn explained German laws have evolved after 9/11.
Broader U.S.-German data sharing is needed, Sonn noted, but
there is a certain level of distrust in the German media
toward the U.S. As a result, it will be easier for the
German side if no existing German laws are changed; the more
the U.S.-German agreement looked like Pruem, the better, he
said. If the U.S.-German agreement looked like Pruem, it
would "insulated from the headlines," according to Sonn. He
urged the U.S. over the next weeks -- before the December
launch of the U.S.-German Working Group -- to establish its
counterterrorism data sharing priorities.


5. (U) This message was cleared by the U.S. delegation
subsequent to their return to Washington.
KOENIG