GERMAN INTERIOR MINISTRY TO OPEN DIALOGUE WITH

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 03 BERLIN 001654 SIPDIS SIPDIS E.O. 12958: DECL: 06/08/2021 TAGS: PGOV SOCI KISL GM SUBJECT: GERMAN INTERIOR MINISTRY TO OPEN DIALOGUE WITH ISLAM REF: (A) BERLIN 1069 (B) BERLIN 1070 Classified By: Acting PolCouns John Lister. Reason: 1.4(b) an (d) ¶1. (C) Summary. After weeks of media attention on immigration and integration policy, German Interior Minister Schaeuble has decided to organize a conference and meet directly with representatives of a number of Islamic organizations. The decision represents a significant policy shift for the German government, which in the past has rejected such direct dialogue. The conference, planned for September, would start a 2-to-3 year dialogue meant to lead to conclusion of an agreement between the state and the organizations on the role of organized Islam in Germany. Among the participants will be the "Islamic Community Mili Goerus," previously seen as unacceptably fundamentalist and potentially subversive, for which reason Schaeuble will reportedly not meet directly with them. Also taking part will be Ditib, the Turkish government-linked organization that previously had rejected dialogue with other Islamic organizations. Interior Ministry and some Islamic contacts believe the Minister's step, taken on his own authority, is a breakthrough in state-Islam relations in Germany. End Summary. Background -------------- ¶2. (C) Germany's relations with its primarily Turkish immigrant Muslim community have been marked by a lack of official contact between the government (at state and federal levels) and Muslim organizations, especially since 9/11/2001. Partly due to security concerns (many Muslim organizations are under observation by federal and state Offices for the Protection of the Constitution (OPC) as at least potentially subversive),partly for German bureaucratic reasons, and partly due to cultural-political reasons, politicians and officials have generally avoided dialogue with Muslim groups. Government contacts generally cite the lack of a single umbrella organization with whom the government could speak as a reason for rejecting dialogue with any one group. As recently as May 10, Heidrun Tempel, responsible for religious affairs in the Chancellery, repeated all of these arguments for Poloff in explaining why Muslim organizations were unlikely to be invited to the so-called "Integration Summit" planned by the Chancellor before the summer break. However, other contacts have indicated discomfort at the lack of direct dialogue. Maximilian Mueller-Haerlin, Office Director for Federal Integration Commissioner Boehmer indicated in April that the Embassy's dialogue with Muslim groups could be a positive example for the government. In a similar vein, Muslim leaders last fall commented that it surprised them that, although they had attended U.S.-hosted Iftaar dinners (in some cases, more than once) in Germany, they had never been invited to, or even heard of, a German government-hosted Iftaar dinner. ¶3. (C) According to Interior Ministry A/S for Immigration and Integration Lehnguth, the view that no dialogue was possible with Muslim groups remains fairly widespread. Within the Interior Ministry family, both the Federal Office of Criminal Investigation (BKA) and OPC were against dialogue with groups they consider subversive, even if non-violent. Schaeuble simply overruled them, Lehnguth reported. Rainer Krappen, on the Minister's staff, confirmed that the decision was the Minister's. Lehnguth also dismissed opposition from CDU/CSU members of parliament -- some of whom have argued that no Muslim group in Germany is an acceptable dialogue partner. Schaeuble's Plan -------------- ¶4. (C) According to Lehnguth, Schaeuble plans a first "plenary" session of the dialogue in September. Participants will be drawn from government, Muslim organizations, and from among independent experts/NGOs. He mentioned specifically Ditib, the Islamic Council, and the Central Council of Muslims as invitees among Muslim organizations. Central Council Spokesman Mounir Azzaoui told us other invitees might include the Association of Islamic Cultural Centers, and the Alaouite and the Ahmadiniya organizations. As experts, Lehnguth mentioned several Muslim politicians, some individuals who also have leading roles in Moslem groups, and others, including author and Islam-critic Necla Kelek. After the plenary, the dialogue would break into three working groups - one each on work, ethics/values, and business as a bridge to integration. Krappen clarified that the Ministry saw a role for Mili Goerus in the working groups, but not in the plenary, and that Mili Goerus would have no direct contact with Schaeuble. (Note: Mili Goerus advocates the eventual, peaceful introduction of Sharia into Germany.) BERLIN 00001654 002 OF 003 ¶5. (C) A two-to-three years process of dialogue on issues of concern, such as Islamic instruction in German schools, would ensue. The goal of the dialogue would be the conclusion of an agreement between the groups (who might by them be represented by a single umbrella organization) and the state on Islam's role in the state, similar to agreements the two major churches and the Jewish community have with the state. Partially walking back previous German government views, Lehnguth indicated considerable realism about the chances of bringing the fissiparous Muslim community under a single umbrella. Lehnguth indicated such an outcome would be welcome, but that it was not essential to a successful outcome. Many Questions, But Overall Welcomed by Muslims -------------- -- ¶6. (C) Asked his view of the dialogue plan, Ditib General Secretary Yildirim said "dialogue is always better" than SIPDIS isolation, but said he had no information on the specifics and that Ditib had not yet received an invitation. He speculated that Interior Minister Schaeuble may be leading the dialogue because the Chancellery did not believe it possible to include Muslim groups in its "Integration Summit." Yildirim was unwilling to give a view on the participation of Mili Goerus or other groups absent a decision by the Ditib Board on participation. ¶7. (C) Central Council Spokesman Azzaoui, who appeared quite well-informed about the Ministry's plans, broadly welcomed the dialogue, which he believed would also make a positive contribution toward the establishment of an umbrella organization representing most Muslim organizations. It was particularly important, he said, that the Interior Ministry was willing to invite Mili Goerus, because that was an effective lever to ensure the participation of Ditib in the dialogue. Ditib, by far the largest single Muslim organization, has in the past generally rejected a broad dialogue because of its size and quasi-official status. Azzaoui, whose organization hopes to gain influence in an umbrella organization, speculated that the Ministry might try to steer the dialogue in that direction. He was concerned, however, at Ministry plans to include a large number of organizationally unaffiliated "experts" among the "Muslim" participants in the dialogue. He asked what role non-representative experts can play if the goal of the dialogue is to reach an agreement between the government and the Muslim organizations. ¶8. (C) Christian Hoffman, Director of the Muslim Academy, a forum for unofficial dialogue, said he welcomed the Minister's "statement that he will meet" with Muslim groups, but was unhappy that the Ministry had not consulted with his group. He said he was only aware of what had been in the press and could not therefore comment more substantively, but he also signaled some skepticism about whether the dialogue would actually take place. Working Level in Chancellery and Bundestag Not Informed -------------- -------------- ¶9. (C) Schaeuble's step was apparently not coordinated in advance within the government - at least not below the cabinet level. According to Heidrun Tempel, Chancellery Office Director for Religious Affairs, she only knew what she had read in the papers. She stressed that Ministers in Germany have the authority to act within their own field, so Schaeuble's step was not a problem. She did note that some confusion had arisen between the Interior Ministry plans and Chancellery plans for an "Integration Summit" in June. The two, she stressed, were entirely separate and she foresaw no specifically religious element in the Chancellery effort. Michael Guentner, Office Director of CDU/CSU Caucus Chairman Kauder, confirmed that Schaeuble's decision had also not been made after consultation with the party caucus in the Bundestag and that the question of the suitability of Islamic groups for dialogues remains open in party ranks. "We still have to get used to dialogue," he explained. Comment: More Than Meets the Eye -------------- ¶10. (C) The details of Schaeuble's plan indicate a new beginning mixed with a large measure of caution. In particular, the Ministry's concern is evident in the decision to keep Mili Goerus at arm's length and the inclusion of non-representative "experts," many of whom may have a liberal/secularist orientation, which the Ministry could use to balance views it may find objectionable from Muslim organizations The plenary/3 working group set-up and the BERLIN 00001654 003 OF 003 diversity of Islamic interlocutors will make for a complicated process. However, the specifics of the plan should not obscure the significance of the move. Barbara John, former Berlin Commissioner for Migration and Integration, described it as the culmination of a too-long but essential process of recognizing that the struggle against terrorism can not be successful if non-violent (even if conservative) Muslim groups are marginalized. And that has been the political status of Muslim organizations until Schaeuble's move, many observers agree. Until now, while cities and states have had varying degrees of formal and informal interaction with Muslim groups, the federal government has lacked routine and even symbolic processes (e.g., participation in annual public ceremonies) of political engagement between organized Islam and the federal state. The national political class, starting this fall, is to begin to talk with, rather than just about, its Muslim citizenry and population. End Comment. TIMKEN