Identifier
Created
Classification
Origin
02MILAN338
2002-06-12 15:05:00
UNCLASSIFIED
Consulate Milan
Cable title:  

QADHAFI'S SON ON ITALY-LIBYA RELATIONS

Tags:  PTER PINR PINS PREL PGOV PHUM EFIN ECON 
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R 121505Z JUN 02
FM AMCONSUL MILAN
TO SECSTATE WASHDC 8015
INFO AMEMBASSY ROME 
AMCONSUL NAPLES 
AMCONSUL FLORENCE 
EU MEMBER STATES COLLECTIVE
AMEMBASSY ALGIERS 
AMEMBASSY TUNIS 
AMEMBASSY CAIRO
UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 02 MILAN 000338 

PARIS FOR RESSLER
DEPT FOR S/CT, EUR/WE, EB/ESC, DRL/BA, INR/NESA,
NEA/ENA, PM/SRP

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: PTER PINR PINS PREL PGOV PHUM EFIN ECON
EIND, MARR, MOPS, IT, LY

SUBJECT: QADHAFI'S SON ON ITALY-LIBYA RELATIONS

UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 02 MILAN 000338

PARIS FOR RESSLER
DEPT FOR S/CT, EUR/WE, EB/ESC, DRL/BA, INR/NESA,
NEA/ENA, PM/SRP

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: PTER PINR PINS PREL PGOV PHUM EFIN ECON
EIND, MARR, MOPS, ITALY'>IT, LY

SUBJECT: QADHAFI'S SON ON ITALY-LIBYA RELATIONS


1. SUMMARY: SEIF QADHAFI, SON OF LIBYAN LEADER
MUAMMOR QADHAFI, SPOKE AT ISPI (INSTITUTE FOR THE
STUDY OF INTERNATIONAL POLITICS) IN MILAN, JUNE 10 ON
"LIBYA AND ITALY: ECONOMIC AND POLITICAL ISSUES WITHIN
THE MEDITERRANEAN AREA." SEIF QADHAFI, WHO WAS
INTRODUCED AS THE PRESIDENT OF THE "LIBYAN
HUMANITARIAN FOUNDATION, HEAD OF THE NATIONAL
CONSULTING GROUP," AND AN EXPERT ON BUSINESS
CONSULTING AND ARCHITECTURE, SPOKE ON THE OBLIGATION
FOR ITALIAN COMPENSATION FOR COLONIAL CRIMES AS ONE OF
THE PRECONDITIONS FOR BETTER RELATIONS BETWEEN NORTH
AFRICA AND EUROPE. HE MENTIONED THE UNITED STATES
ONLY IN PASSING, SAYING THAT U.S. BASES IN ITALY
SHOULD NOT BE USED TO ATTACK LIBYA AND THAT THERE WAS
NO EVIDENCE THAT HIS COUNTRY WAS INVOLVED IN
LOCKERBIE. HE SAID THAT LIBYA'S INVESTMENT IN FIAT
WAS STRICTLY A BUSINESS DECISION. MANY OF HIS
STATEMENTS WERE ILLOGICAL, ALMOST BIZARRE, AND THE
ITALIAN AUDIENCE LEFT SOMEWHAT CONFUSED AND
UNIMPRESSED. END INTRODUCTION AND SUMMARY.

ELIMINATE THIS BLACK SPOT
--------------


2. SEIF QADHAFI BRIEFLY REVIEWED ANCIENT HISTORICAL
AND CULTURAL TIES BEFORE JUMPING TO ITALY'S OCCUPATION
OF LIBYA. HE REFERRED TO MASSACRES AND CONCENTRATION
CAMPS AND SAID THAT LIBYA IS STILL SUFFERING AND
PEOPLE ARE STILL DYING DUE TO WHAT ITALY DID. THIS IS
THE REASON THAT LIBYA IS BACKWARD TODAY. LATER IN HIS
TALK HE SAID THAT ONE MILLION LIBYANS WERE KILLED BY
THE ITALIANS, MANY IN CONCENTRATIONS CAMPS. THERE IS
NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THESE DEATHS AND THE JEWISH
DEATHS IN WORLD WAR II CONCENTRATION CAMPS. THE
QUESTION IS NOW HOW TO ELIMINATE THIS "BLACK SPOT."

AND HERE IS WHAT ITALY HAS TO DO
--------------



3. QADHAFI SAID THAT A PERMANENT BILATERAL TREATY AND
COMPENSATION IS NECESSARY. A SMALL HOSPITAL, SMALL
SCHOOL OR CLEARING THE MINEFIELDS IS NOT ENOUGH TO
ABOLISH THE BLACK SPOT. WHAT ITALY SHOULD PROVIDE IS
EDUCATION AND INVESTMENT, EDUCATION BEING THE MOST
IMPORTANT. ITALY SHOULD FINANCE SCHOLARSHIPS FOR
LIBYANS TO STUDY IN ITALY OR IN EUROPE, "AND NOT 10 OR
20 OR 80, BUT AN IMPORTANT NUMBER." IN ADDITION, THE
GOI SHOULD SPONSOR AN EXCHANGE OF PROFESSORS.


4. QADHAFI SAID THE GOI CLAIMS THAT THEY HAVE NO
MONEY IN THE BUDGET FOR COMPENSATION, BUT THIS CAN BE
SOLVED THROUGH INCREASED INVESTMENT INSTEAD.
INVESTMENT SHOULD BE DIRECT PRIVATE SECTOR TO PRIVATE
SECTOR. INVESTMENT FLOWS SHOULD NOT INVOLVE THE STATE
BECAUSE OF GOVERNMENT CORRUPTION: "LIBYA OR ITALY, IT
IS THE SAME THING." HE STRESSED THIS AGAIN LATER IN
HIS TALK, SAYING THAT FUNDS SHOULD NOT BE CHANNELED
THROUGH THE LIBYAN GOVERNMENT BECAUSE OF BUREAUCRATIC
INEFFICIENCY AND CORRUPTION. MORE SPECIFICALLY,
QADHAFI PROPOSED THAT THE GOI GIVE TAX RELIEF TO
LIBYAN COMPANIES THAT LOCATE IN ITALY, ITALIAN
COMPANIES THAT INVEST IN ITALY, OR ITALIAN BANKS WHO
MAKE LOANS TO LIBYAN COMPANIES. THIS, QADHAFI CLAIMED
WOULD NOT COST ANYTHING TO THE ITALIAN BUDGET.


5. TRYING TO MAKE THE MORAL ARGUMENT FOR
COMPENSATION, QADHAFI SAID THIS IS WHAT SWITZERLAND
DID FOR ISRAEL; SO THE SAME THING SHOULD BE DONE BY
ITALY FOR LIBYA. HIS VOICE RISING, GADDAFI SAID, "WE
HAVE A RIGHT TO BE COMPENSATED. MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY
DIED IN THAT WAR." HE WENT ON TO CLAIM THAT FRANCE
WAS PRESSURING ITALY NOT TO DO ANYTHING FOR LIBYA
BECAUSE THEN FRANCE WOULD BE OBLIGATED TO DO THE SAME
THING FOR ALGERIA. HE NOTED THAT PRIME MINISTER
BERLUSCONI HAS BEEN INVITED TO LIBYA, BUT HE CANNOT
VISIT UNTIL THE COMPENSATION ISSUE IS RESOLVED, HE
ADDED.

CONDITIONS FOR BETTER RELATIONS WITH EUROPE
--------------


6. SHIFTING FROM BILATERAL RELATIONS TO REGIONAL
RELATIONS, HE SAID THAT AN AGREEMENT BETWEEN NORTH
AFRICAN NATIONS AND THE EU DEPENDED ON CERTAIN
PRECONDITIONS. FIRST, EACH SIDE MUST AGREE NOT TO USE
THEIR TERRITORIES AS A BASE TO ATTACK EACH OTHER.
THAT MEANS, FOR INSTANCE, THE U.S. COULD NOT USE BASES
IN ITALY TO ATTACK LIBYA. SECOND, THE EU SHOULD LIFT
ITS MILITARY EMBARGO ON LIBYA. BOTH OF THESE ARE
VITAL FOR LIBYAN SECURITY AND ARE PRECONDITIONS FOR
NEGOTIATION. LATER, HE COMMENTED THAT NATO EXPANSION
TO THE SOUTH (TO INCLUDE LIBYA) WOULD BE "WISE, A VERY
GOOD IDEA."


7. ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE EQUATION, NORTH AFRICAN
COUNTRIES MUST SUPPORT DEMOCRACY AND HUMAN RIGHTS. IF
THERE WERE DEMOCRACY AND HUMAN RIGHTS IN NORTH AFRICA,
THERE WOULD BE "NO ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION" AND "NO BOMBS
IN PARIS." HE LATER CONDEMNED "FAKE DEMOCRACY" IN THE
MIDDLE EAST, WHERE LEADERS CONSTANTLY ARE ELECTED WITH
99 PERCENT OF THE VOTE. "ONE LEADER RULING FOREVER IS
NOT DEMOCRACY," HE SAID (WITHOUT IRONY).


8. TURNING TO IMMIGRATION, QADHAFI NOTED THAT ILLEGAL
IMMIGRATION IS A BIG PROBLEM IN LIBYA. ILLEGAL
IMMIGRANTS ENTER HIS COUNTRY, CAUSING PROBLEMS AND
COMMITTING CRIMES BEFORE MOVING ON TO ITALY. BECAUSE
THE MAJOR VICTIM OF IMMIGRATION IS ITALY, ROME SHOULD
HELP LIBYA WITH JOBS AND INVESTMENT TO KEEP THESE
ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS OUT.


LIBYA AND FIAT: STRICTLY BUSINESS
--------------


9. QADHAFI SAID LIBYA'S RECENT INVESTMENT IN FIAT WAS
A STRAIGHT BUSINESS DEAL. THE GOVERNMENT PURCHASED A
PIECE OF FIAT THROUGH A GOL INVESTMENT COMPANY. IT
WAS A NORMAL INVESTMENT: "WE HAVE LOTS OF EXTRA HARD
CURRENCY," HE SAID. (NOTE: ACCORDING TO THE ITALIAN
FINANCIAL PRESS, IN FEBRUARY 2002, THE LIBYAN ARAB
FOREIGN INVESTMENT COMPANY, LAFICO, PURCHASED 2
PERCENT OF FIAT. EARLIER, LAFICO PURCHASED
APPROXIMATELY 5 PERCENT OF SOCCER CLUB JUVENTUS, WHICH
LIKE FIAT IS CONTROLLED BY THE AGNELLI FAMILY. SIEF
QADHAFI IS A BIG FAN OF JUVENTUS AND IS SOMETIMES SEEN
AT THEIR GAMES. COMMENT: SO FAR, THE JUVENTUS
INVESTMENT HAS TURNED OUT BETTER THAN THE FIAT
INVESTMENT. WHILE FIAT IS IN SERIOUS FINANCIAL
TROUBLE, JUVENTUS WON THE ITALIAN A LEAGUE
CHAMPIONSHIP IN MAY. END COMMENT. LAFICO IS ALSO
SAID TO OWN SMALL PIECES OF ENI AND TELECOM ITALIA.
THE LIBYAN ARAB FOREIGN BANK ALSO OWNS 5 PERCENT OF
BANCA DI ROMA. END NOTE.)

LOCKERBIE
--------------


10. QADHAFI DID NOT BRING UP LOCKERBIE HIMSELF, BUT
RESPONDING TO A QUESTION FROM THE AUDIENCE HE SAID
THAT THERE WAS NO EVIDENCE THAT LIBYA WAS BEHIND
LOCKERBIE. LIBYA WAS CONDEMNED BEFORE THE TRIAL AND
THIS IS DISCRIMINATION AGAINST ARABS. BESIDES, MANY
OF THE VICTIMS' FAMILIES DO NOT THINK THAT THE
CONVICTED MAN IS GUILTY.


11. COMMENT: THE SPEECH WAS DELIVERED TO AN
INTERESTED, OVERFLOW CROWD. HOWEVER, QADHAFI PROBABLY
DID LITTLE TO ADVANCE ITALIAN-LIBYAN RELATIONS.
SPEAKING IN ENGLISH, SOFTLY ALMOST INAUDIBLY AT FIRST,
HE QUICKLY PICKED UP PACE AND VOLUME WHEN HE BEGAN TO
TALK ABOUT ITALIAN WAR CRIMES AGAINST LIBYA. HE
SEEMED FIXATED ON THE NEED FOR ITALIAN REPARATIONS AND
HIS TALK WAS FULL OF UNREALISTIC, ILLOGICAL AND
SOMETIMES BIZARRE ASSERTIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS.
NEAR THE END HE STARTED TO RAMBLE, AND SOME OF HIS
STATEMENTS WERE NONSENSICAL, BUT THAT TO COULD HAVE
BEEN DUE TO LANGUAGE PROBLEMS. AT THE END, THE
AUDIENCE ONLY ASKED A FEW QUESTIONS, CLAPPED POLITELY
AND QUICKLY FILED OUT, A FEW SHAKING THEIR HEADS.
THEY SEEMED MOST UNIMPRESSED. END COMMENT.

MCELHANEY