CHARGE'S OCTOBER 18 MEETING WITH THE FOREIGN

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 03 KINSHASA 001215

SIPDIS

SIPDIS
NSC FOR BLEO

E.O. 12958: DECL: 10/19/2017
TAGS: EMIN ETRD KPAO MOPS PGOV PREL KPKO KWMN PHUM
CG
SUBJECT: CHARGE'S OCTOBER 18 MEETING WITH THE FOREIGN
MINISTER: WILL ANTIPAS MBUSA REMAIN IN THE
KABILA GOVERNMENT?

REF: A. (A) KINSHASA 1171

B. (B) STATE 142614

Classified By: Charge SBrock: Reasons 1.4 (b/d).


1. (C) Summary: Foreign Minister displayed little knowledge
of the objectives and aspirations of President Kabila's
upcoming official visit to the U.S. He even wondered aloud
if he would remain in the government after the long-expected
cabinet reshuffle, which many observers believe will come
before the end of the year. Mbusa and Charge covered a wide
range of topics, including sexual violence in the DRC, the
conflict in the east of the country, and mining sector
reform. Normally ebullient and forthcoming, Mbusa was
withdrawn and admitted to not being well informed. His fear
of being shuffled out of the government may prove to be well
founded. End summary.


2. (U) Charge d'Affaires Brock hosted Antipas Mbusa,
Minister of State for Foreign Affairs and International
Cooperation and at a working breakfast October 18. Also
present was political counselor David Brown.

Sexual violence
--------------


3. (SBU) Charge began the conversation by thanking Mbusa for
the warm reception he had received at the ministry on October
1 from Vice-Minister Alain Lubamba (acting for Mbusa, who was
at the UN General Assembly),who gave assurances that the DRC
would fully support U.S. efforts at the UNGA to obtain a
resolution condemning the use of rape as an instrument of
state policy. Mbusa acknowledged he had not heard of the
U.S. initiative and asked for more information. Charge also
proposed that the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the U.S.
Embassy work together to commemorate the "International Day
for the Elimination of Violence against Women" (ref B).
Mbusa agreed and promised to stay in touch with us on ideas
for joint efforts to mark this day. Mbusa, who is from the
east of the Congo where sexual violence is most pronounced,
noted that mass rape is a serious problem with armed groups
in the east and evinced embarrassment over the fact that
government troops are also to blame.

Kabila's trip to Washington
--------------


4. (C) Mbusa turned to the upcoming trip to Washington by
President Joseph Kabila. He asked what we expected from the
trip. Charge said the USG would emphasize three areas:
satisfaction over the DRC's transition to constitutional
democracy and the strengthening of the country's
institutions, a more intense economic partnership, and the
situation in the east. Mbusa said the visit would dispel the
doubts of many here about U.S. support for the DRC. He
agreed with the Charge that many of the Congo's problems are
a result of the collapse of the state. He expressed anger
over a "diatribe" carried by French International Radio (RFI)
of recent statements in the U.S. by Azarias Ruberwa,
attending a conference at an American university,
acknowledging, however, that much of what Ruberwa (a
prominent Tutsi politician who served as a vice-president in
the transition government) had said was true.


5. (C) Charge asked Ruberwa what the Congolese are expecting
from the trip. Mbusa, whose uneasy, rambling patter belied a
lack of familiarity of Kabila's views, answered: (a) support
for the peace process and help in expanding state authority;
and (b) cooperation with the DRC in the creation of wealth
here, especially in the mining sector.

That knotty Nkunda problem
--------------


6. (C) The conversation moved to Nkunda. Charge asked Mbusa
for his thoughts on how to facilitate the renegade general's
departure. Were there any countries other than South Africa
willing to receive Nkunda? Mbusa cited Ethiopia as a
possibility. Charge noted that legal advice was needed to
know if the government that takes him is obligated to honor a
Congolese extradition request, particularly if no extradition
treaty exists between the DRC and the receiving country.

KINSHASA 00001215 002 OF 003


Mbusa said that Kabila's public statements against lifting
the arrest warrant would make it difficult to persuade Nkunda
to leave.

Just as knotty FDLR problem
--------------

7. (SBU) Mbusa said the proposal for FDLR repatriation or
resettlement now with Kigali was drafted by him at Kabila's
request. Church groups in North and South Kivu are working
with a Norwegian NGO to stand up a program to implement the
program. Plans for a conference of FDLR leaders (to include
the insurgency's not-criminal political representatives) are
moving forward. Rwanda and the DRC have agreed to
participate. The time frame will most likely be moved back
into November from the hoped for October 22-24 date. (Note:
Post forwarded the DRC plan for FDLR
repatriation/resettlement to AF. End note.) On DDR, Mbusa
also noted that the head of the defense ministry's new DDR
unit is prepared to resign because of frustrated over a lack
of international funding.


Kabila's future travel; China
--------------


8. (C) Mbusa believes Kabila is likely to visit Russia in the
near future. China and India should follow. Mbusa said
Kabila's India trip would include the signing of an
assistance protocol. Mbusa asked for U.S. advice on dealing
with China. Charge noted that China's overarching interest
at present is in securing raw materials. The DRC should use
its vast resources to better advantage. He suggested that
the government might contract with specialized firms for a
national survey of mineral wealth and then award mining
concessions on the basis of a specific area's estimated
value, rather than on imprecise barter agreements as those
signed recently with China. The disadvantages of such
agreements, in addition to their lack of transparency and
appearance of possible corruption, were that the DRC could be
selling its mineral resources at prices below market value.
This was similar to colonial trade arrangements. Charge
noted that in time China will probably adhere to current
trade agreements and structures because failure to do so
could result in the loss of markets in developed countries.
Mbusa said he had not been briefed on details of the China
agreements and asked where the GDRC could find the expertise
needed to conduct a nationwide mineral survey. Charge
offered to help him locate firms and stated that the World
Bank might be able to finance this kind of project.

Rumors; cabinet reshuffle
--------------


9. (C) Pol counselor asked Mbusa about a recent trip to
Harare by presidential advisor Augustin Katumba and a
delegation that included defense minister Chiquez, Katanga
military region commander Padiri, and Central Bank president
Masongu. Mbusa did not respond. The delegation was
scheduled to visit Luanda after Harare; Mbusa was not sure if
it had done so. Mbusa asserted that oil minister Mende is
erratic; his disorganization "had confused the situation with
Angola and Uganda. Although a PPRD member, he is not close
to Kabila." Charge asked about a long-awaited cabinet
reshuffle. Mbusa was jarringly frank: "I am not anxious for
the reshuffle to take place as I might not remain in the
government."

Comment
--------------


10. (C) Mbusa was not his normal ebullient and forthcoming
self. When asked if he knew when Kabila is returning to
Kinshasa (he was in Goma earlier in the week and has since
traveled to Katanga),he said he did not know. He would not
even say that he was going to Washington and we do not have
(it is now Friday afternoon) a request for a visa to depart
with Kabila and the delegation on Monday, although his 30 day
visa to attend the General Assembly may still be valid. It
was evident that the presidency is keeping close hold on the
trip and that Mbusa was speaking in a personal capacity
throughout the meeting. The foreign minister has been a
major player in the Kabila government's many diplomatic

KINSHASA 00001215 003 OF 003


initiatives vis-a-vis the DRC's neighbors, an effort which
have resulted in closer ties with Angola and Uganda and, to a
lesser extent, with Rwanda. He does not appear to be
involved, however, with the Washington trip. And he is also
on the outside re Kabila's plans to defeat the Nkunda
insurgency in the east, a conflict that impinges greatly on
DRC-Rwanda relations and has a high UN content. When the
reshuffle occurs, we would not be surprised if Mbusa is dealt
a poor hand. End comment.
BROCK