Identifier
Created
Classification
Origin
06KHARTOUM796
2006-03-30 13:26:00
UNCLASSIFIED
Embassy Khartoum
Cable title:  

Pres. Bashir Interview with Al-Jazira at Arab

Tags:  PGOV PREL SOCI AL US SU 
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VZCZCXRO7069
PP RUEHROV
DE RUEHKH #0796/01 0891326
ZNR UUUUU ZZH
P 301326Z MAR 06
FM AMEMBASSY KHARTOUM
TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC PRIORITY 2112
INFO RUCNIAD/IGAD COLLECTIVE
RUCNFUR/DARFUR COLLECTIVE
UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 05 KHARTOUM 000796 

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DEPT FOR AF/SPG
DEPT PLS PASS USAID FOR AFR/SUDAN

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: PGOV PREL SOCI AL US SU
SUBJECT: Pres. Bashir Interview with Al-Jazira at Arab
League Summit


UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 05 KHARTOUM 000796

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DEPT FOR AF/SPG
DEPT PLS PASS USAID FOR AFR/SUDAN

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: PGOV PREL SOCI AL US SU
SUBJECT: Pres. Bashir Interview with Al-Jazira at Arab
League Summit



1. Summary: In a March 29 interview with Al-Jazira,
President Bashir said: many southern forces had
supported the government during the North-South civil
war; Khartoum was both a northern state and the national
capital subject to shari'ah law; the Arab League had
pledged to support AMIS financially for six months and to
provide additional troops; the U.S. had interest in Sudan
in terms of both it as an electoral issue and for the
sake of its oil; international peacekeeping troops would
come to Darfur to stay and not to end the conflict there;
the situation in Darfur was mischaracterized and did not
involve mass killings; use of development assistance
funds would keep Sudan united; and CPA implementation has
been slowed by a variety of factors, due both to the
actions of the North and the South. End summary.


2. Following the March 28-29 Arab league heads of State
Summit, Al-Jazirah television interviewed President
Bashir. The lengthy interview touched on a variety of
sensitive issues, including Darfur, international
peacekeeping troops, U.S. interests in Sudan, the North-
South situation, and the implementation of the
Comprehensive Peace Agreement (CPA). Media reactions to
President Bashir's statements will follow by septel.
Selected excerpts are as follows:

(Begin text excerpts)

Sudan's South:

Regrettably, the media depicted the issue of the South as
a problem between an Arab Muslim North and a black
Christian South. If one looks at the formation of the
fighting forces, he will discover that they do not
reflect the picture some try to draw. There were large
southern forces which supported the government. All the
people heard about the militias. These were one of the
security problems. These were huge militias in large
numbers. They represented very influential tribes in the
South. These militias fought alongside the government
troops. We say the problem is now over, praised be God.
That problem caused us much trouble with many African
countries. They sympathized with the (Sudan) People's
(Liberation) Movement and (words indistinct). This has

ended, praised be God. After reaching peace in the
South, we have become more qualified to be an element of
support for Arab-African relations.

The agreement (CPA) is very clear. The agreement
resulted in an interim constitution. According to the
constitution, every state has the right to have its own
constitution but within the framework of the federal
constitution. I reject such talk (of the constitution of
Khartoum being Taliban in nature). If talk is about our
adherence to the shari'ah (Islamic law),that will then
not be something new. In the agreement we stressed that
Islamic shari'ah is the source of legislation in northern
Sudan. Khartoum is a northern state and at the same time
it is the national capital.

The agreement gave the capital other things. It said the
representation of the South in Khartoum will be different
from its representation in the rest of states. We have
reached agreement on this representation in Khartoum with
the People's Movement. The second point is that a
committee will be set up to guarantee the rights of non-
Muslims in Khartoum. If the people who talk want the
constitution of Khartoum to be secular, there will be no
need for a special committee to protect the rights of non-
Muslims. This means the constitution is Islamic and the
laws are Islamic. But under this Islamic constitution
and these Islamic laws a committee was set up to protect
the rights of non-Muslims in Khartoum.

AMIS Support:

With regard to financial aid, a figure was mentioned, but
in internal deliberations the conferees said what is
required is covering the expenses of troops for six
months. This is what was mentioned in the resolution. It
said the Arab countries will cover the expenses of the
African forces in Darfur for six months as of 1
October...There is talk about increasing the number of
these troops. The number of the additional troops has
not been decided. Therefore, it is difficult to fix a
sum. The Arab countries pledged to pay the cost for six
months.


KHARTOUM 00000796 002 OF 005


There is talk about sending Arab African peacekeeping
forces to Darfur. These are African forces from Arab
African countries. These countries will decide the size
of these forces. All the Arab African countries like
Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Algeria, Morocco, (words
indistinct) which has still not become a full African
Union member, and Mauritania. These are the countries
with military capabilities. There are Egyptian observers
in Darfur now. The Libyans are there. These are Egypt,
Libya, and Algeria.

U.S. Interests in Sudan:

This question (of U.S. pressure) should be directed to
the Americans. Our problems have become one of the
elements of the U.S. domestic policy. Whenever there are
elections in the United States, some files become part of
the election campaign. Regrettably, we have become part
of the files of these election campaigns. Certainly there
are political forces and forces of pressure in the
Congress and in the U.S. media which talk about Darfur.
The problem is that we have become part of the internal
electoral files.

Sudan's geographic location is very important. We are
located in the heart of Africa and overlook nine African
countries and the Red Sea. Sudan has huge resources. It
has oil, gas, and minerals of all types. Sudan has water
sources and fertile soil. All these are the object of
the ambitions of others. If we look at the map of
Africa, we will find that the countries where there are
big problems are the ones with large capabilities. You
will find Congo, which has a huge wealth of gold and
diamond. You will find Angola and Sudan. I recall that
once a company contacted the Senegalese president
offering to prospect for oil in Senegal, but he said I do
not want problems; I do not want prospecting. This is
one thing. The other thing is the position of Sudan. We
have an independent political position. We rejected many
of the U.S. policies in the region. We strongly rejected
the invasion of Iraq. We continue to reject all calls to
recognize Israel or normalize relations with it. All
these create a political force targeting Sudan within the
United States and for all sorts of reasons. I will give
you a simple example. Oil in Sudan was discovered by
U.S. firms. They came and prospected for oil. They dug
tens of wells. They might have defined the oil reserves.
At that time they had enough oil and did not need
additional oil. They left in the hope of returning. We
heard from some Americans that this is American oil and
they will not leave it to the Chinese, Malaysians, and
others.

We are an independent country and we will protect our
independence and sovereignty. We will not accept any
decision related to us if we do not approve it.

International Peacekeeping Forces in Darfur:

This is because we believe that these (international
peacekeeping) forces will come to Darfur to stay there
and not to solve the problem. The issue of Darfur began
as a local traditional problem which took place there
from time to time and it was solved traditionally. There
was war in the South. Therefore, they (western powers)
did not care about problems in other places. They thought
that the problem or the war in the South would be enough
for them to achieve all their aims in subjugating or
defeating the Khartoum government and even occupying
Khartoum through the rebel movement. When operations
continued and the initiative was completely in the hands
of the armed forces, we heard the western countries --
the United States, Britain, and their allies -- talk
about a cease-fire in the South for the first time. When
we began negotiations, we called for a cease-fire in the
South. The strange response was fight and talk
(preceding three words in English as heard). This is so
although when any mediator intervenes to resolve any
armed conflict in the world, the first thing he will
demand is observing a cease-fire. This happens
everywhere except in Sudan. After making sure that peace
was inevitably coming to the South and that three days
remained to sign the protocols which constituted the
basic peace agreement, we heard that the issue of Darfur
was referred to the UN Security Council. They knew that
the problem there would not last long unless there was an
international interference that would impose certain
conditions. We fought for 50 years in the South, but the

KHARTOUM 00000796 003 OF 005


issue was not referred to the UN Security Council. The
issue (of Darfur) was referred to the UN Security Council
only when we were about to reach peace (in the South) so
that they would say after interference that they wanted
peace before the end of the year. They fabricated this
issue. If we sign a peace agreement in Darfur today,
there will be plans for other areas. These plans are
made outside Sudan.

Therefore, we have to face our destiny and try to solve
our problems by ourselves. We will not accept any
solutions from abroad.

If things are imposed on Sudan, it will have no other
option but confrontation. If things are imposed on it,
what can it do? It must either confront or surrender.
We will not surrender. We do not know who will finally
be victorious because victory comes only from God. This
is what is required. No forces should come without our
approval and we have not approved the dispatch of such
forces.

Also not in the future. As happened in the South, we can
think of the role the United Nations can play once peace
is reached. After agreeing on peace in the South, we
agreed on a role by the United Nations. There are UN
troops in the South now, but they are there with our
approval and upon our request and authorization.

We do not deny that there is a crisis in Darfur. There
is a problem and there are refugees and refugee camps,
but maintaining the problem is a deliberate action. In
April 2004, we signed the cease-fire agreement in
N'djamena. The agreement had specific clauses demanding
the rebels to identify their positions and the points
where forces could be assembled. Simultaneous collection
of weapons in Darfur would then begin. There was
procrastination or lack of desire on the part of the
international community to implement this agreement. If
this agreement had been implemented and positions had
been defined (changes thought). On the first day we
handed the African Union a map of all positions of the
Sudanese Armed Forces. The rebels should have done the
same. They should have revealed the positions of their
forces. Agreement would then have been reached on
specifying the forces' assembly points. If the forces
had been assembled, security chaos in Darfur would have
completely ended. If security chaos had ended, the
humanitarian issue would have been solved automatically
because the people evacuated the area because of the
chaotic security situation. Why do we not implement the
signed agreement? If we implement it, the crisis of
Darfur will end. Envoys came and visited the evacuees'
camps. Yes, there are evacuees. But if we implement the
N'djamena agreement, the evacuees will return to their
areas.

These (reports of killings and other abuses) are all
lies. I tell you these are lies. There is no mass
killing. Fighting was going on and that was normal.
There is fighting now in Iraq. Is there fighting without
death? There is no mass killing. True, some villages
were attacked or burned in reaction to other actions.
When someone attacks, he strikes and loots. Another will
reply to him. Such incidents forced the defenseless
citizens to evacuate, but some camps were attractive even
to city inhabitants because the situation in the camp is
better than the situation in the city. People find free
services in the camp. There are no free services in the
city. There is no free medical care, free water, or free
electricity. All these are available in the camp. Some
people rented out their houses in the city and left for
the camps.

Southern Sudan and the Possibility of Secession

Everything is possible. This depends on what can be
accomplished during this period of time. If we convince
the southern citizen during this period that he is a
citizen enjoying all his citizenship rights, we expect
the majority to say yes (to unity). If we and the
brothers in the southern government and southern states
fail to run the south in a manner that convinces the
southern citizen that he got his rights, this might be a
cause for separation. We believe that most of the
southerners are for unity. Some people, however, say no.
When I visited the South -- Bahr al-Ghazal and Rumbek,
which was the capital of the rebel movement -- I found

KHARTOUM 00000796 004 OF 005


that all people in Rumbek were for unity.

We need the assistance of the international community and
Arab world during this period of time in order to provide
the southern citizens with services and development
projects, which will allow them to make a positive
decision. This is our program and this is our effort.

We, of course, have the pledge made in Oslo to extend
$4.5 billion in aid for development and services
projects. If we receive these funds and carry out the
set plans and programs, there will be unity, God willing.
We cannot carry out these plans depending on our
capabilities no matter how large they are. The South is
a vast area and there has been no development there for
50 years and 50 years ago we were under colonialism.
Colonialism did not spend money to develop the country.
We have a vast area that needs huge efforts. Many of the
evacuees in the North or the refugees who were in
neighboring Ethiopia, Kenya, and Uganda had services
available to them in the refugee camps. If they return
to the South today, they will not find these services
there. Therefore, unless we provide these services,
there will certainly be a problem.

Implementation of the CPA:

We work according to timetables on the implementation of
the agreement. True, there was some delay in the
implementation of some clauses of the agreement, but the
delay was due to the fact that there was a period of six
months before the start of the transitional period. The
agreement was signed on 9 January and the transitional
period began on 9 July. Much work was supposed to be
done during this six-month period before the start of the
transitional period. That work should have been done
through joint committees between us and the Movement.
The committees were supposed to come to Khartoum to do
this work and finish it before the start of the
transitional period, but the Movement did not send its
delegations. Many people who did not know about the
details of the agreement thought the delay was from the
government. However, when we sit with them and explain
why this was not done, they become convinced of our
opinion. Some people get wrong information and begin to
talk on the basis of this information. The people have
heard many say that the government has not given the
South its oil rights. We said we would not respond in
the media. We asked officials in the federal government
and the Government of the South to come and present to us
at the presidency a report on the implementation of a
special agreement on oil revenues.
It (the CPA) is not fragile. The agreement has full
details and we are committed to it. Some may try to
interpret some parts, but we have implementation
mechanisms. Regarding the constitution, the Justice
Ministry is the term of reference. It decides if the
constitution agrees or disagrees with the federal
constitution. If there is disagreement, we have the
Council of States, which is the upper house. This is
also a term of reference. We have the commission in
charge of monitoring and following up the implementation
of the agreement. Accordingly, several quarters are
involved in this agreement. If people disagree, they
will go back to them and they will decide.

The national conference some political forces are calling
for is not meant to create a base for this agreement.
The base of this agreement is complete. Most people and
political parties and forces fully support the agreement.
Some political forces, however, say that this is a
bilateral agreement and that the distribution of powers
is unfair because it gives 80 percent of power to the
parties signing the agreement and these are the National
Congress Party and People's Movement. They want a new
conference in order to cancel many points in this
agreement. We do not want to violate the agreement. The
1972 agreement was excellent and well accepted. It
achieved real peace in Sudan, but violating it took us 20
years back to war. It was the one which sowed some sort
of suspicion in the minds of the southerners that we did
not abide by agreements. Therefore, this agreement came
with all details. The reason was past suspicion.

Sudan's Future:

Sudan is an Arab African country. We reject dividing
Africa into Arab and black Africa or north and south of

KHARTOUM 00000796 005 OF 005


the desert. We are now talking about a united Africa and
an African Union representing all African countries.
According to this concept, we find that most of the Arabs
are inside Africa. Therefore, there can be no talk about
Africa without the Arabs. Consequently, one cannot talk
about an African unity without having ties with the
Arabs. The Arabs outside Africa are linked to the Arabs
in Africa. Therefore, all Arabs in and outside Africa
are strongly linked to Africa. Our role is strengthening
Arab-African cooperation in the interest of Africa and
the Arabs.

(End text excerpts)

STEINFELD