U/S DOBRIANSKY SEEKS COORDINATION WITH FRENCH

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 03 PARIS 006903

SIPDIS

E.O. 12958: DECL: 09/30/2015
TAGS: PREL PHUM KSCA SOCI AMED KDEM PGOV KUNR VE IS FR UNGA IRC
SUBJECT: U/S DOBRIANSKY SEEKS COORDINATION WITH FRENCH
OFFICIALS ON DEMOCRACY PROMOTION, VENEZUELA, IPAPI AND MDA


Classified By: Deputy Chief of Mission Karl Hofmann, Reasons 1.4b,d


1. (C) SUMMARY: U/S for Democracy and Global Affairs
Dobriansky met with French MFA Director Jean-Maurice Ripert
(IO A/S-equivalent) September 30 to discuss democracy
promotion, the challenge in Venezuela, coordinated action
against avian flu, and prospects for a solution on use of the
Israeli MDA emblem. Ripert voiced concern that any campaign
to promote democracy could interfere with actions at the UN
and elsewhere to further codify human rights protections. He
recommended the USG find a way to signal that democracy
promotion was not a substitute for action on human rights.
Ripert declared France had now earmarked a million euro for
the UN Democracy Fund, but retained questions about its
structure. On Venezuela, South America DAS-equivalent Pinard
claimed the situation was less dire than usually portrayed
and that the press was "completely free." U/S Dobriansky
pressed the urgency of successfully launching the
International Partnership on Avian and Pandemic Influenza
(IPAPI) and received assurances that France would send
representatives to the October 6-7 Senior Officials Meeting
in Washington. On Magen David Adom (MDA) membership in the
ICRC, PDAS-equivalent for Middle East/North Africa Bonnaud
believed use of the Israeli emblem itself was less
problematic than continuing negative developments on the
ground. Ripert did not expect the Swiss to convene a
conference on MDA this year. END SUMMARY.


2. (U) U/S Dobriansky met with French MFA IO A/S-equivalent
Jean-Maurice Ripert on September 30 at a breakfast meeting
hosted by DCM Hofmann. The French side also included IO
PDAS-equivalent Jean-Pierre Lacroix, Human Rights Desk
Officer Donatienne Hissard, South America DAS-equivalent
Michel Pinard, Middle East/North Africa PDAS-equivalent
Gilles Bonnaud, and MFA Health Counselor Frederic Dore.
Political Counselor Rosenblatt, Science Counselor Robert Dry,
Senior Adviser Nicole Bibbins Sedaca, and Poloff also
attended.

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Democracy Promotion
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3. (C) Ripert stated that France, like the U.S, viewed
democracy as the natural guarantor of human rights.
Nonetheless Ripert worried that an actual campaign of
democracy promotion might interfere with other efforts on
advancing human rights, particularly in those countries where
progress can be made on human rights but not necessarily on
democracy in the short term. Moreover, reforming the
Commission on Human Rights should be the first order of
business, he said. Any campaign to promote democracy
inevitably carried "political" freight, which could spark
controversies to the detriment of what France viewed as the
main objective -- promulgating universal legal instruments
for the protection of human rights. "Democracy is of course
good for human rights, but not on the same level," he opined.


4. (C) U/S Dobriansky countered with the example of
democracy promotion in Afghanistan, where the drafting of a
constitution had engaged actors from all sectors, especially
women, in the protection of human rights. Where, she asked,
would France envision advancing a human rights agenda
independently of democracy promotion? China, suggested Quai
d'Orsay Human Rights desk officer Donatienne Hissard. For
Europeans, Hissard claimed, the focus should be on promoting
rule of law, since democracy is achieved by increments.
Noting there were cases of democracies failing to protect
human rights, IO PDAS-equivalent Jean-Pierre Lacroix remarked
that the European and American approaches might be diverging,
with Ripert adding that the differences were not just
tactical. Agreeing to a universal and legally binding
instrument to safeguarding the rights of children, for
instance, was a different goal than that of disseminating
democratic principles. Ripert suggested there would be value
in a message from the USG to the effect that democracy
promotion did not conflict with the international human
rights agenda. He proposed coordinating with Mali, the
current president of the Community of Democracies (CD).


5. (C) France had now earmarked 1 million euro to the UN
Democracy Fund, Ripert declared. He commented that France
nonetheless had certain questions about the structure of the
Fund, which must not be seen "to weaken the UN system."
(Note: Hissard told Poloff 9/29 there were concerns that the
terms of reference inadequately take into account the role of
UNDP and the Commission of Human Rights.) U/S Dobriansky
stressed agreement with the arguments made by Ripert at the
April 2005 meeting of the Community of Democracies in
Santiago, Chile: i) the CD is not a substitute for the UN;
ii) the CD operates as a complement to regional groupings in
international organizations; iii) the UN Democracy Fund
should not duplicate functions already in place elsewhere in
the UN system. Ripert noted with surprise that a total of
146 nations actually qualified as democracies to participate
in the CD.

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Venezuela
--------------


6. (C) U/S Dobriansky replied that Venezuela posed a
particular challenge as a democratically elected government
that was increasingly undemocratic in its actions.
Continuing, she urged support for NGOs in Venezuela seeking
to speak out, greater coordination between EU and Latin
American countries, and a freeze on sales of arms or
aircraft. She expressed concern about prospective military
aviation sales to the Chavez government and asked about the
October 20-21 visit by Chavez to France. South America
DAS-equivalent Michel Pinard, who served in Caracas from
1989-1993, was evasive on any French action. He argued that
Venezuela was not as dire a situation as portrayed, since
there was a "completely free" and very active press and no
signs of repression by Chavez of the media. Pinard added
that there were many opponents, too, but there was no
coherent political opposition. He stressed the huge
democratic support for Chavez, his surge in popularity since
the 1992 coup and his subsequent election, reelection, and
likely future reelection once again. "It is difficult to
talk about resistance of civil society," Pinard said, and
important to grasp that "Chavez is the symbol of the
(historically) dominated people."


7. (C) Pinard described Chavez's persona as "surprising,
unique probably in South America," distinct from that of
Uribe, Kirchner, and Lula, "yet so far not crossing the
boundary to dictatorship." There was political harassment,
he admitted, yet there were also large and frequent
demonstrations. Chavez nonetheless stood to benefit from
some "discreet pedagogy" given "without aggression," he said.
When pressed, he averred that France would offer such advice
during Chavez's visit. Pinard suggested coordinating with
other South and Latin American leaders, specifically Lula and
Fox. Pinard did not address U/S Dobriansky's inquiry about
possible military aviation sales. (Note: Pinard told
PolCounselor he will meet with representatives of the
Venezuelan NGO Sumate on October 18 in advance of the Chavez
visit.)

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Avian Flu
--------------



8. (SBU) U/S Dobriansky emphasized the need for coordinated
action to address a possible avian flu pandemic. She
welcomed France's involvement in the International
Partnership on Avian and Pandemic Influenza (IPAPI),
stressing that its purpose was "to breathe life" into the
WHO, FAO and OIE in order to obtain needed resources and
enhance their ability to access countries vulnerable to a
viral outbreak. The Senior Officials Meeting (SOM) in
Washington October 6-7 would in no way supersede
international organizations or other ongoing avian flu
preparation activities. Nor did the U.S. plan, in sponsoring
this partnership, to create additional structures of
bureaucracies. She explained that the partnership's purpose
should not be limited to human health alone, but needed also
to address animal health. She noted that Canada planned to
host a meeting of health ministers later in October and that
the WHO would conduct a needs assessment in November to meet
the challenge of a pandemic, efforts which could only be seen
as complementary to IPAPI.


7. (SBU) Director Ripert responded that he knew FM
Douste-Blazy's strong views on IPAPI. Douste-Blazy welcomed
the partnership initiative and would send a delegation to
Washington for the SOM. Although the composition of the
delegation was not set, he expected it might include the
interministerial coordinator on avian influenza preparedness,
Dr. Didier Houssein. Ripert noted that France wants to see
appropriate support for WHO and OIE. He said that France has
already sent doctors and "is bringing" medical supplies to
the WHO. In no way did France want to upset "the existing
dynamics" of these international bodies. Ripert appreciated
Dobriansky's assurances that the partnership would not create
new bureaucracies. With regard to the SOM itself, Ripert
said that France would not agree to any statements or
declarations in advance of the meeting itself. Such
statements should reflect the actual discussions undertaken
and the actions agreed, Ripert said.

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MDA
--------------


8. (C) U/S Dobriansky noted possible signs of progress in
resolving Magen David Adom membership in the Red Cross/Red
Crescent movement, specifically that the Palestinian
Authority apparently may not oppose the 3rd Protocol. It was
important to reinforce the Swiss position that the issue is
humanitarian and not political, she said. PDAS-equivalent
for Middle East/North Africa Bonnaud agreed with U/S
Dobriansky that the Palestinian attitude was more generally
"positive"; the deteriorating situation on the ground, not
the emblem itself, was the greater obstacle to a solution.
Ripert averred there was a continuing difficulty with the use
of the MDA emblem without first a settlement of territorial
disputes; the problem is the use of the MDA emblem in the
context of an occupation. He doubted the Swiss would convene
the proposed international conference on the issue at this
time. He suggested a compromise might be possible to
authorize use of the MDA emblem for 5 years in up to 5
different geographic locations.
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