SPAIN: U/S DOBRIANSKY'S MEETING WITH FM MORATINOS

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 04 MADRID 003492

SIPDIS

G FOR U/S DOBRIANSKY AND BIBBINS SEDACA
EUR/WE FOR ALLEGRONE, CLEMENTS, AND HALL

E.O. 12958: DECL: 09/28/2015
TAGS: PREL PGOV SP
SUBJECT: SPAIN: U/S DOBRIANSKY'S MEETING WITH FM MORATINOS

Classified By: DCM Bob Manzanares; reason 1.4 (B) and (D)


1. (C) Summary. Under Secretary for Democracy and Global
Affairs Paula Dobriansky visited Madrid on 9/27 and met with
Foreign Minister Miguel Angel Moratinos and Director General
for Political Affairs Rafael Dezcallar for wide-ranging
discussions on democracy promotion, potential areas for
collaboration in the Broader Middle East and Latin America,
avian flu, and climate change. Moratinos said U.S.-Spain
relations were on a positive track and identified cooperation
in counterterrorism and in the rebuilding of Afghanistan as
key elements of the bilateral relationship. He emphasized
Spain's efforts to help the Iraqi government get through its
current difficulties. Moratinos discussed his recent meeting
with NEA PDAS Elizabeth Cheney in which he announced Spanish
support for BMENA initiatives. U/S Dobriansky noted the
USG's desire to collaborate on the Alliance of Civilizations,
but also flagged some concern regarding the reported
participation by former Iranian President Khatami as a member
of the UN High Level Group. She urged Spanish support for
the Budapest International Center for Democratic Transition;
FM Moratinos said Spain strongly backed the Center and was
working with Hungary on democracy promotion in the Balkans.
On Venezuela, Dobriansky asked that Spain encourage EU
vigilance during its election monitoring and asked that
Moratinos work to halt the sale of Spanish ships and planes
to the Chavez government. Moratinos said the Spanish
equipment was "mainly for transportation," but also noted
that no final contract had been signed yet with Venezuela.
Moratinos suggested the USG and Spain work together to
convene a seminar in Venezuela to help strengthen civil
society and opposition groups. In a follow-on meeting with
Dezcallar, U/S Dobriansky discussed support for Cuban
democracy activists, USG efforts on avian flu, Magen David
Adom, and, climate change. End Summary.


2. (C) U/S Dobriansky thanked Moratinos for Spain's moral and
material support in the wake of Hurricane Katrina and for the
expressions of condolence following the crash of the U.S.
helicopter in Afghanistan. Moratinos said bilateral
relations were strong and cited cooperation against terrorism
and collaboration in the rebuilding of Afghanistan as
priorities in the bilateral relationship. He noted Spain's
agreement to host a United States official in its PRT in
western Afghanistan, which DG Dezcallar confirmed but said
required a "memorandum of understanding" before the USG
official could join the PRT. (NOTE: The Embassy later
clarified with Dezcallar that Spain would incorporate the
State Department officer in the PRT, but only after final
agreement on the terms of his participation and after the
Spanish civilian component had been established in Qal-i-Naw.
END NOTE).

//IRAQ//


3. (C) Turning to Iraq, Moratinos emphasized Spain's
forward-looking posture, saying the Spanish government was
beyond its previous concerns regarding Iraq and wanted to
help the Iraqi government get past its current crisis. As
examples he cited Spain's financial contribution to support
the Iraqi electoral system and its dispatch of a medical
aircraft to retrieve victims of the bridge stampede for
treatment in Spain. Dezcallar also noted that Spain had
selected the Iraqi military members who would participate in
de-mining training in Spain. Moratinos said that Spain had
wanted to send its ambassador to Iraq to Baghdad, but the
killings of diplomats from several countries had convinced
them that the security situation remained too unstable. He
said that EU foreign ministries, whose missions would be
outside Baghdad's Green Zone, were reviewing possible joint
solutions to secure their embassies.

//BMENA - ALLIANCE OF CIVILIZATIONS//


4. (C) U/S Dobriansky expressed appreciation for Spain's
contributions in Iraq and said training for lawmakers would
also be useful and welcome, since democracy and human rights
were closely intertwined. FM Moratinos discussed his recent
conversation with NEA PDAS Elizabeth Cheney on the margins of
the UNGA, saying he had used the meeting to announce Spain's
intention to contribute financially to BMENA. Dobriansky
said the USG would greatly appreciate contributions for both
the Fund for the Future and the Foundation for the Future.
She discussed the USG's interest in supporting the Alliance
of Civilizations, though there was also some concern
regarding the possible participation of former Iranian
President Khatami in the UN High Level Group formed to
promote the initiative. Dezcallar said that Khatami might be
on one of the High Level Group panels, but that decisions
regarding the makeup of the High Level Group rested with the
UN Secretary General. He suggested Khatami might not be
interested in participating since he had been a major backer
of the "Dialogue of Civilizations," which never made any
progress. Moratinos said this was the first time he had
heard that Khatami's participation might pose problems for
the USG.

//PRO DEMOCRACY ACTIVITIES//


5. (C) U/S Dobriansky encouraged Spanish support for the
Budapest-based International Center for Democratic
Transition, particularly in light of Spain's own transition
from dictatorship to democracy, as well as its lessons
learned on transitioning from a monarchy to a constitutional
monarchy, a lesson which could be of use to other monarchies
in the world today. Moratinos noted that he had mentioned
the Budapest Center during his speech at the last meeting of
the Community of Democracies and said Spain was working with
Hungary in democracy promotion activities in the Balkans. He
said North Africa, particularly Algeria and Morocco, required
international support to move them in a positive direction.
Moratinos suggested that the U.S. and Spanish Embassies in
Rabat could work together in this effort. Dobriansky pointed
to Morocco's recent appointment in the Convening Group of the
Community of Democracies as a positive development.

//VENEZUELA//


6. (C) Moratinos discussed his participation in President
Zapatero's March visit to Venezuela, during which he met with
the leaders of the Venezuelan pro-democracy NGO "Sumate."
U/S Dobriansky stressed the need for the USG and Spain to
work together in Venezuela and urged Spain to ensure EU
vigilance in its monitoring of the upcoming elections. She
asked that Moratinos do everything possible to halt the
Spanish arms sale to Venezuela, a sale that sent the wrong
signal to both the Chavez government and the opposition.
Moratinos insisted that the equipment being sold to Venezuela
was primarily transport equipment, but also said that no
contract had been signed between Spain and Venezuela
regarding the sale.


7. (C) Moratinos said that Chavez' electoral victory, and his
subsequent win in the referendum, complicated efforts to deal
with him. He emphasized the need to work with the
opposition, "whose own political mismanagement in a sense
gave birth to Chavez." He asked that we come back to them
with some specific proposals as to how to help the
opposition. Moratinos said the USG and Spain should not pick
favorites, but should work closely to strengthen the
opposition and help them rebuild legitimacy. He said we need
to look for opportunities to support the judiciary, media,
and legal sectors. He suggested the USG and Spain jointly
convene a seminar aimed at strengthening civil society.

//MEETING WITH DG FOR FOREIGN POLICY DEZCALLAR//


8. (C) Immediately following her meeting with Moratinos, U/S
Dobriansky continued her discussion on Venezuela with DG
Dezcallar. She urged Spain to use its considerable influence
to support the work of pro-democracy activists in Latin
America. Dezcallar said his meetings with USG officials in
New York on the margins of the UNGA had given him a sense
that the USG had fewer concerns regarding Spanish policy
towards Venezuela than was the case several months ago. He
expressed his conviction that the summit among the leaders of
Venezuela, Brazil, Colombia, and Spain and Spain's
organization of an exchange between Venezuelan and Colombian
judges had had a calming influence in the region. Dezcallar
said it was important that Chavez understand that others in
the region would hold him to democratic standards.

//CUBA//


9. (C) U/S Dobriansky requested Dezcallar's assessment of
whether the shift in Spanish/EU policy towards Cuba had
achieved any progress, noting the USG's view that conditions
had not improved. Dezcallar said that Spain did not expect
any significant changes in Cuba until Castro was gone from
the scene. In his view, the best that could be achieved were
limited victories, such as the release of individual
political prisoners and a very limited political opening.
Dezcallar cited the civil society meeting organized by
dissident Martha Beatriz Roque in May as an "unprecedented"
event and implied that Spain had pressured the Cuban
government to tolerate the gathering. He was pessimistic
regarding the possibility of a substantial political opening,
but said it would be critical to have a presence in Havana
when change finally did come. Dezcallar said the Cuban
government's freeze on contacts with EU diplomats had not
advanced European objectives in Cuba and therefore Spain had
worked to reestablish official relations.


10. (C) Dezcallar said the USG-Spain discussions on Latin
America on the margins of the UNGA had been fruitful and he
hoped that they would result in direct contact between USG
and Spanish officials who are planning ahead for the Cuban
transition. He repeated his view that there was little
chance of advancing democracy objectives in Cuba as long as
Castro remained in power. U/S Dobriansky said she understood
Spain's frustration; the USG had engaged in a regular
dialogue on human rights with the Chinese government for
several years, but froze that dialogue once we realized we
were making no headway in resolving the underlying human
rights problems in China.

//RED CROSS-MAGEN DAVID ADOM//


11. (U) On the issue of Magen David Adom (MDA),U/S
Dobriansky said that Switzerland had committed to hold a
conference before the end of 2005. The USG hoped to see a
specific date set soon. There has been movement in the
Organization of the Islamic Conference on MDA and a meeting
soon would generate further positive momentum. Dezcallar
said that Spain, like the USG, sees this as a humanitarian
issue. He observed that there are differences of opinion
within the Palestinian leadership, with Palestinian Authority
leader Abbas accepting MDA, but Foreign Minister Al-Kidwa
more problematic. Dezcallar highlighted Spain's recent
measures designed to improve relations with Israel, including
it's first-ever commemoration of a Holocaust remembrance day
in January 2005 and plans well underway for the establishment
of a "Casa Sefarad" (Hebrew House) in Madrid to celebrate
Spain's Jewish heritage.

//AVIAN FLU//


12. (U) U/S Dobriansky discussed the USG's deep concern
regarding the threat of a global pandemic related to avian
influenza and our hope that Spain would join the
International Partnership on Avian and Pandemic Influenza
(IPAPI). She explained that the USG's core principle in this
endeavor was transparency, with coordination among all the
key players, including the World Health Organization (WHO).
She urged Spain to send a delegation to the Senior Officials
Meeting October 6-7 in Washington, which is intended to help
ensure that all appropriate measures are in place to monitor
and respond avian flu. Dobriansky noted that she had
discussed this issue with MFA Director General for
International Organizations and Multilateral Affairs Arturo
Laclaustra earlier in the day (septel). She said the USG
understood that Spain was waiting for a coordinated EU
position to emerge from the September 30 COREPER meeting in
Brussels, but hoped Spain would participate in IPAPI
regardless of the results of the September 30 meeting.
Dezcallar assured U/S Dobriansky that Spain would be helpful
on this issue.

//CLIMATE CHANGE//


13. (U) Dezcallar said Spain's Ministry of the Environment
had asked him to raise the Kyoto Protocol with U/S Dobriansky
and to inquire whether there had been any shift in the USG
position. U/S Dobriansky said that USG policy is not to go
forward on the Kyoto Protocol, but to implement a policy
aimed at slowing the emission of greenhouse gases while
maintaining productivity. The USG also continues to work
with other countries on renewable energy projects. Dezcallar
said that a meeting of the minds between the EU and the U.S.
on climate change was important, but that recent events had
made it even more urgent, including Russia's entry into the
Kyoto Protocol, the recent hurricanes in the U.S., and
rapidly spreading desertification in Spain. U/S Dobriansky
noted that we shared the same goals as the EU, but had
different views as to how we should achieve those objectives.
The U.S. view was that we should focus on what can be done
now to reduce greenhouse gas emissions and develop the
technology that will allow us to limit future emissions
without sacrificing growth. U/S Dobriansky also indicated
USG skepticism regarding the utility of shifting greenhouse
gas emissions from one region to another (e.g. trading
emissions) if the overall objective was to reduce the global
production of such gases. She said it was also important to
gather as much information as possible to track climate
change, which is why the USG had supported the creation of
the Group on Earth Observations to monitor the phenomenon.


14. (U) U/S Dobriansky cleared this report.
AGUIRRE