Identifier
Created
Classification
Origin
05BRUSSELS543
2005-02-07 14:52:00
UNCLASSIFIED
Embassy Brussels
Cable title:  

S/CT POPE AND EU CT COORDINATOR DE VRIES REVIEW

Tags:  KCRM KJUS PREL PTER USEU BRUSSELS 
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This record is a partial extract of the original cable. The full text of the original cable is not available.
UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 02 BRUSSELS 000543 

SIPDIS

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: KCRM KJUS PREL PTER USEU BRUSSELS
SUBJECT: S/CT POPE AND EU CT COORDINATOR DE VRIES REVIEW
U.S.-EU COOPERATION


UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 02 BRUSSELS 000543

SIPDIS

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: KCRM KJUS PREL PTER USEU BRUSSELS
SUBJECT: S/CT POPE AND EU CT COORDINATOR DE VRIES REVIEW
U.S.-EU COOPERATION



1. Summary. Acting CT Coordinator William Pope met with EU
CT Coordinator Gijs de Vries to review areas of current and
potential future cooperation on terrorism. Asked by de Vries
where EU Member States should invest more effort, Pope
responded that Europeans should look carefully at their legal
structures, including the lenient sentences being given to
convicted terrorists. The MS need to look also at small
Islamic groups which are not assimilating into European
society. De Vries noted the obstacles to using intelligence
information in criminal prosecutions and that the EU was
interested in working with the U.S. on this. Regarding CT
assistance to third countries, de Vries noted the EU intended
to visit Morocco soon to look at its financial intelligence
units and police training and is considering a visit to
Tanzania. The EU is pleased with the new CT center in
Jakarta and is open to further assistance to this
organization. The EU also wants to explore potential future
assistance with Pakistan. He praised U.S.-EU cooperation
generally, including terrorist finance and judicial/police
cooperation with Europol and Eurojust. He especially noted
EU satisfaction with the Policy Dialogue on Border and
Transport Security. De Vries promised to look into the
Commission competency issue affecting bilateral U.S. Coast
Guard assessments of international port security in EU Member
States. End summary.


2. In a courtesy call on the EU's CT Coordinator Gijs de
Vries following their joint appearance at a Brussels
conference on European Security, Acting CT Coordinator
William Pope reviewed areas of current and potential future
cooperation on terrorism. Asked by de Vries where EU Member
States should invest more effort, Pope responded that
Europeans should look carefully at their legal structures,
including whether CT laws are in place that would enable law
enforcement to work more effectively, and at the lenient
sentences being given to convicted terrorists. The MS need
to look also at small Islamic groups which are not
assimilating into European society. De Vries acknowledged
the wide divergence in sentencing practices throughout the
Union, but said there has been some recent harmonization of
minimum sentences. The EU needs to do more in terms of

critical infrastructure protection. De Vries noted the
obstacles to using intelligence information in criminal
prosecutions and said the EU was interested in working with
the U.S. on this. "Bringing terrorist criminals to court and
convicting them is fundamental to winning public support for
the governments' CT program," de Vries said.


3. Regarding CT assistance to third countries, de Vries
noted the EU intended to visit Morocco soon to look at its
financial intelligence units and police training and is
considering a visit to Tanzania. The EU is pleased with the
new CT center in Jakarta and is open to further assistance to
this organization. The EU also wants to explore potential
additional CT assistance with Pakistan. Pope observed that
an area needing attention by the West is education and public
diplomacy about our CT objectives and motivation. For
example, while the majority of the religious schools in
Pakistan and Indonesia perform well their educational duties,
there is a minority of these schools where hatred of the West
is taught with minimal government oversight or restrictions.
Our assistance programs to third countries should include
efforts to redress this situation.


4. De Vries praised U.S.-EU cooperation generally, including
terrorist finance. Judicial and police cooperation with
Europol and Eurojust are underway. He especially noted EU
satisfaction with the Policy Dialogue on Border and Transport
Security. De Vries asked about the U.S. commitment to
station an FBI agent at Europol. USEU/NAS Kerber responded
that the FBI had opened a suboffice in The Hague on December
5 to handle both bilateral and Europol business with an
emphasis on terrorism. He further noted that the assignment
of an FBI agent to Europol was predicated on the
revitalization of its counter terrorism task force. The
exact functions of this agent depend on how this unit
develops.


5. De Vries asked the U.S. view on efforts within the UN for
a new convention to define terrorism. Pope responded that he
was not hopeful about this initiative. A universal
definition of terrorism has not been possible to achieve to
date. De Vries commended the recent disaster management
exercise held in DC by Johns Hopkins and the U. of
Pittsburgh, and suggested this issue be considered for future
U.S.-EU cooperation.


6. Pope raised the U.S. Coast Guard (USCG) mandate to assess
the effectiveness of anti-terrorism measures in international
ports. The U.S. has approached several EU Member States to
do such an assessment and some have indicated an interest in
a visit by the USCG. But the EU Commission has said it has
competency over this issue, thus halting the bilateral
discussions. De Vries said he wasn't aware of this issue but
thought the Commission may indeed be on "solid legal ground"
with its claim. He promised to look into the issue and get
back to the Mission.

This cable has been cleared by S/CT Pope.

Schnabel
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