RUSSIAN DEFMIN IVANOV'S EXTRA DAY IN ANKARA: BLACK

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 02 ANKARA 006967

SIPDIS

E.O. 12958: DECL: 12/14/2029
TAGS: PREL MASS MARR PINR RS TU IZ
SUBJECT: RUSSIAN DEFMIN IVANOV'S EXTRA DAY IN ANKARA: BLACK
SEA, IRAQ, CHECHNYA AND SALES

REF: A. ANKARA 6887


B. ANKARA 6845

C. ANKARA 6867

Classified By: Political Military Counselor Timothy A. Betts. Reasons 1
.4 (b) and (d).


1. (C) Summary: Russian Defense Minister Ivanov, accompanied
by Russian Navy Chief ADM Kuroyedov, had wide-ranging
discussions with Turkish DefMin Gonul December 7, the day
after President Putin departed. According to an MND
official, Ivanov (unlike Putin--ref a) professed no problem
with Turkey's potential EU membership. Ivanov and Gonul
agreed to improve cooperation against WMD proliferation and
trafficking in the Black Sea and exchanged views on Iraq,
with Ivanov suggesting Moscow is willing to sell arms to "a
legitimate government of Iraq." The two ministers had a pro
forma exchange on Georgia and Chechnya. Ivanov sought
greater access for Russian defense industry to the Turkish
market; Gonul complained about maintenance problems with
Russian helicopters and utility boats already in the Turkish
inventory. Three defense agreements were signed: prevention
of incidents at sea, protection of proprietary defense
industry information, and protection of classified
information exchanged pursuant to defense industrial
cooperation -- all termed "routine" by our MND briefer. End
Summary.

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Turkey's EU Membership -- No Problem for Russia
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2. (C) MND Policies and Principles Director RADM Serdar
Dulger briefed PolmilCouns December 13 on the December 7
meeting between Russian Defense Minister Sergey Ivanov and
Turkish Defense Minister Vecdi Gonul. Both Ivanov and
Russian Navy Chief Admiral Vladimir Kuroyedov accompanied
Putin during the President's December 5-6 visit, and both
stayed in Ankara an extra day for additional meetings; both
attended the meeting with Gonul. According to Dulger, Ivanov
told Gonul that Turkey's NATO and possible EU membership
"won't bother us at all." Russia is in a position to develop
relations with not only Turkey, but NATO, the EU and the US,
Ivanov said. (Comment: This is in contrast to what we heard
were Putin's admonishments to the Turks he met that Turkey
did not need and should not enter the EU--see ref a. End
Comment.)

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Desire for More Cooperation in the Black Sea
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3. (C) Dulger said that the ministers devoted significant
time discussing the Black Sea. Ivanov reaffirmed Russia's
commitment to participation in BLACKSEAFOR. (Note:
BLACKSEAFOR was a Turkish initiate launched in 2001 to build
cooperation among Black Sea littoral states' navies.
Beginning as annual exercises, BLACKSEAFOR has developed a
political dialogue at the vice ministerial level and a
rotating command structure. In June 2004, participants
agreed to expand the mandate to include naval cooperation to
counter terrorism, WMD proliferation and trafficking.)
Ivanov called for Turkish-Russian cooperation to make
BLACKSEAFOR "more effective and practical" in combating
organized crime and proliferation.


4. (C) Related to this discussion, Dulger said that Kuroyedov
had a separate meeting with Turkish Naval Forces Commander
ADM Ornek. Although he did not know what they had discussed
in the meeting, Dulger had attended a number of social events
hosted by Ornek. At these events, Kuroyedov, who speaks no
English, exhibited little knowledge of the Black Sea as most
of his experience was in the Far East. Nevertheless, he was
supportive of enhanced cooperation among the littoral states,
stating "our cooperation on these issues (focusing
BLACKSEAFOR on fighting terrorism, WMD proliferation and
trafficking) should go beyond written declarations." He also
expressed support for Turkey's unilateral BLACKSEAHARMONY
operation which is based on NATO's Operation Active Endeavor
in the Mediterranean.

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Iraq
--------------


5. (C) Gonul told Ivanov that in Iraq Turkey wants elections
to occur on time everywhere. In the end Ankara wants a
stable Iraq; instability in Iraq would be bad for Russia as
well as Turkey he said. Gonul listed three factors that were
important to prevent turmoil in Iraq: territorial integrity,
centralized control over the armed forces, and preserving
Iraq's natural resources for use by all Iraqis and not by
foreigners.


6. (C) For his part, Ivanov said that Russia was not sending
military equipment nor personnel to Iraq. However, if asked
by a "legitimate Iraqi government," Moscow would consider
selling arms to Baghdad. Though Russia has forgiven 80% of
its Iraqi debt, Iraq still owed Russia $6-7 billion, so any
arms would need to be paid for, he said.

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Defense Cooperation
--------------


7. (C) Dulger reported that Ivanov promised Gonul that
Russian companies would compete to sell Turkey a wide variety
of defense equipment, including helicopters. Gonul welcomed
the Russians' interest in the Turkish defense market. He
then raised some specific maintenance and spare parts issues
regarding Russian-origin helicopters currently in service
with the Jandarma and specialized utility boats (e.g., tugs,
etc.) in the Turkish Naval Force's inventory. The Russians
agreed to look into them.


8. (C) Three agreements were signed during the visit. Dulger
characterized them as "routine and not specific." The most
significant was an agreement between the Russian Ministry of
Defense and the Turkish General Staff on the prevention of
incidents on the high seas. The other two were within the
framework of previous agreements. One was on protecting
intellectual property rights on information exchanged under
the military technical cooperation agreement. The other was
to protect classified information exchanged under the defense
industry cooperation agreement.

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Other Issues: Georgia and Chechnya
--------------


9. (C) Other issues touched on in the meeting included:

-- Georgia/CFE: Gonul urged Russia to fulfill its Istanbul
commitments; Ivanov changed the subject.

-- Terrorism: Ivanov noted that Turks were among the foreign
fighters found in Chechnya; Dulger said Gonul "noted the
Russian complaint" and asked Russia to recognize the
PKK/Kongra Gel as a terrorist organization.

EDELMAN